REQUEST FOR COMMENT: Petition text -- READ THIS!!!! --

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Genesis,

In my opinion you have watered down the warranty issue from the clear and specific claims of the earlier document. It is now briefly noted in what is primarily a pricing paragraph (1). I think its better to seperate the issues and keep them as clear and simple as possible.

Items 2 and 3 basically deal with two seperate but related issues.

Also the background would be better solid without pattern to enhance legibility. And need more contrast with the color of the letters in the button.

We must be driving you crazy by now.

Have you given some thought on how to get the messege out in the various dive publications. Possibly in the form of an article, or other.
 
but there's a good reason not to.

From my conversations with manufacturers over the last two weeks I am aware of more than one that I believe may bend - or break - on one or more of these issues.

Getting one or more of them to bend on ALL of them is another matter, and will take more work - and a bunch of signatures.

But one must reward those who you convert, even if only partially, if you want success.

And "reward", in this case, means listing them on the "Good List."

If you separate out warranty from the sales restraints, then you have no loaf at all if someone does the first of the bullet points. That's no good for the diver; it effectively leaves you where you are now, with LP (with their own warranty), SS or DiveInn being there, but all with "ship and wait" warranty service. Second, warranty is really a sales issue - at least that's how the threatening signs are playing it in the dive shops.

On the other hand, if you get a manufacturer that will commit to the first point - no price, sales, or warranty restraints on their dealers - then we get a BIG chunk of what we're after. Yes, the service issues remain, and are still worth going after, but a big, and immediate, benefit gets shoved out to the consumer.

I think the three - price restraints, method of sale restraints, and warranty issues - have to go together in that first bullet.

Finally, the petition contains the following language:

Finally, warranties must apply to all goods sold "new" to the end user or consumer at retail, irrespective of who actually performs the selling.


That sounds pretty concrete to me, but I'm most open to wording that would make it even stronger.... :)

I'm also trying to separate out the three issues in the "Good List", which gives a manufacturer an incentive to get listed for a partial endorsement.

I suspect that the dive publications won't touch this with a 10-foot polespear. Especially Rodales, which was implicated in the SRA lawsuit by the FTC many years ago. I could be wrong about that though. We'll see.

Part of this campaign involves printing up tank (and bumper - small size for the bumper, but good for the tank) stickers. I'm working that issue right now - it may take me a month or two to get them in, due to the lead times for quantities (I intend to run several thousand) but I'll get 'em and make 'em available at very close to cost (a buckish a piece in small numbers, less if you want a bunch of them for a club or something similar.)

Plus, of course, resources like Scubaboard, and anyone who is willing to spread the word to dive clubs and others. I will be doing some outreach to the dive clubs that I am able to find as well, and encourage others to do so also.

I'l see what I can do about the contrast on the buttons. It looks fine on my monitors here (I have both an LCD and a tube to check it on) but that I'm sure I can improve. I may be able to lighten up the background; no promises on that one.... I like the texture though; it gives it more of a "parchment" flavor.
 
Genesis,

From my conversations with manufacturers over the last two weeks I am aware of more than one that I believe may bend - or break - on one or more of these issues.

Getting one or more of them to bend on ALL of them is another matter, and will take more work - and a bunch of signatures

But one must reward those who you convert, even if only partially, if you want success

I generally agree with the premise, nonetheless each and every demand should be clear and specific. It is up to them to decide which issue they redress if any.

Any one stance we change with respect to the various issues is a gain and should be rewarded as pointed out by the last two highlighted paragraphs.

The last three specific requests highlight specific demands except for warranty issues. I guess this is my stickler here.

In my opinion warranties are a product and customer service issue. Of course all service issues are related to sales.
I'm also trying to separate out the three issues in the "Good List", which gives a manufacturer an incentive to get listed for a partial endorsement.
Got it. How about they meet us half way, two out of four, if they want to get "good" recognition.
Finally, warranties must apply to all goods sold "new" to the end user or consumer at retail, irrespective of who actually performs the selling.
This addresses the issue of manufactureres warranties but does not address the issue of the dealer honoring such warranties. When you take your car to the dealer for warranty they don't say sorry but you didn't buy from us send it in to the manufacturer.

I can tell you like that "parchment flavor". How about you make it crisp and clear practical white so in the future it can naturally acquire that "parchment flavor" :)
 
Genesis once bubbled...
From my conversations with manufacturers over the last two weeks I am aware of more than one that I believe may bend - or break - on one or more of these issues.

Getting one or more of them to bend on ALL of them is another matter, and will take more work - and a bunch of signatures.
Yes, but... I know that I was REALLY hot to trot about the first petition text. I even ran a copy down to the tech at the local LDS to get his comments and ask if he would let me give out the URL at the next dive club meeting. I would have to say I am still excited about this version, but much less optimistic about getting people fired up about it. That is a really subjective opinion, I know... I just wanted to point out the balance between making it acceptable to the manufacturers and getting people excited about it.

I would really like to see more people contribute their perspective to this issue. Does the simpler text motivate you the same, or were you more fired up with the longer preamble explaining ALL our grievances in depth?
 
I really like your faqs that you added, for me at least it answers the questions that were taken out f the petition when shortened.

I'm in, thanks for doing this.
Rice
 
This addresses the issue of manufactureres warranties but does not address the issue of the dealer honoring such warranties. When you take your car to the dealer for warranty they don't say sorry but you didn't buy from us send it in to the manufacturer.

That's definitely a valid point.

Four points works, with a requirement that a manufacturer meet at least two in order to get on the "good list." "Meeting us halfway" sounds good too :)

Let me diddle this a bit.... and thanks for the comments!

DJ: What did the LDS say about it? :)
 
on the web page.

The banner at the top will also be the design for the bumper / tank stickers that I am going to have printed up.

These will be quite cheap (defined: around a buck each with an SASE for singles, and MUCH cheaper for significant quantities) for those who want them..... I'm going to run a large (somewhere between 1000 and 5000, depending on who I select to do the printing) quantity of them initially..... so there will be plenty to be had.

Unfortunately it looks like getting a reasonable price on them will mean they will take a month or so to get in.... more when I have a hard shipping date for them....
 
You guys are always complaining, now put your signiture where your mouth is. I saw only 2 signatures!!!
 
https://www.shearwater.com/products/swift/

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