Russia - instructor caused divers death

[spiderpig]

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A ScubaBoard Staff Message...

Names of the parties involved have been removed

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Sunday, june 12, PADI IDC Staff Instructor [name removed], took 4 divers to AOWD course in a Spas-Kamenskiy lake with vis no more then 1-1.5meters
There were husband and a wife and two other divers.
It was raining Saturday night all night and their dive took place in a ver cold, murky water with very low vis. 5min after the dive started the lady lost her fin (she had two different fins on her) and started panicking, spit her reg and started drowning. She and her husband were taken to the surace with 2 other divers left at the bottom. Probably due to the low vis they didn't saw what happened as they were swimming some 3 meters BEHIND the instructor and the 1st couble (according to the instructor's words).
WHen [name removed] dived to the bottom again (17met) he found only one diver, [name removed], in the state of shock without his buddy. Asked where his buddy is he replied that he does not now. He was taken to the surface by the instructor. After a few second that they showed up on the surface, [name removed] buddy show up at the surface, started hitting the water with his hands and screaming and then he went down again.
A professional rescue team was looking for a body for FOUR DAYS and coudn't find it. All the search work was done on a pitch black bottom and the rescue team was working in a touch-contact with the bottom, "looking" with their hand, vis on the bottom was zero - pitch black. That is the same bottom where instructtor took the divers for the AOWD course. Probable cause of death - heart attack provoked by a huge ammount of stress in a low vis and cold water.

All four divers were unexpirienced divers with a few OWD dives under their belt. Nevertheless, instructor took all four of them at the same time under the water in a conditions that were not appropriate for AOWD courses with 4 people at the same time. 5* IDC PADI Centre [name removed] who operates that lake has internal rule not to let any instreuctor to dive with more then 2 students. But in the case of a friendly freelancer, they've decided to "just let it go".
As a result, one diver died, another almost drowned.

The instructor diassapeared, noone knows where he is.
His report causes seroius doubt as some data he is presenting are conflicting with each another.

I urge to diving community to inform PADI about this incided.

 

[Tigerman]

How can they have a probable cause of death as heart attack caused by stress when they didnt find a body and thus havent been able to do an autopsy??

If the report you just posted is even half accurate its a textbook example of a minor event leading to the **** hitting the fan in a big and ugly manner

 

[wilde100]

Sunday, june 12, PADI IDC Staff Instructor [name removed], took 4 divers to AOWD course in a Spas-Kamenskiy lake with vis no more then 1-1.5meters
There were husband and a wife and two other divers.
It was raining Saturday night all night and their dive took place in a ver cold, murky water with very low vis. 5min after the dive started the lady lost her fin (she had two different fins on her) and started panicking, spit her reg and started drowning. She and her husband were taken to the surace with 2 other divers left at the bottom. Probably due to the low vis they didn't saw what happened as they were swimming some 3 meters BEHIND the instructor and the 1st couble (according to the instructor's words).
WHen [name removed] dived to the bottom again (17met) he found only one diver, [name removed], in the state of shock without his buddy. Asked where his buddy is he replied that he does not now. He was taken to the surface by the instructor. After a few second that they showed up on the surface, [name removed] buddy show up at the surface, started hitting the water with his hands and screaming and then he went down again.
A professional rescue team was looking for a body for FOUR DAYS and coudn't find it. All the search work was done on a pitch black bottom and the rescue team was working in a touch-contact with the bottom, "looking" with their hand, vis on the bottom was zero - pitch black. That is the same bottom where instructtor took the divers for the AOWD course. Probable cause of death - heart attack provoked by a huge ammount of stress in a low vis and cold water.

All four divers were unexpirienced divers with a few OWD dives under their belt. Nevertheless, instructor took all four of them at the same time under the water in a conditions that were not appropriate for AOWD courses with 4 people at the same time. 5* IDC PADI Centre [name removed] who operates that lake has internal rule not to let any instreuctor to dive with more then 2 students. But in the case of a friendly freelancer, they've decided to "just let it go".
As a result, one diver died, another almost drowned.

The instructor diassapeared, noone knows where he is.
His report causes seroius doubt as some data he is presenting are conflicting with each another.

I urge to diving community to inform PADI about this incided.

My first question is why Spiderpig wants us to inform PADI about this incident, if indeed it occured. 1) No where is an independent report cited on the incident actually happening 2) What makes SB a better informant than Spiderpig who seems to be better informed about the details of the incident?

Second question. Despite local dive guidelines imposed by the dive operator, there is no evidence that the DI contravened PADI guidelines in his instruction. More evidence needs to be raised before an accusation is made.

Spiderpig also does not clarify whether the DI communicated to the 2 remaining students to remain at the bottom to wait for him while he surfaced with the distressed student. It is confusing at this point in his account what happened to the 2 remaining students, did they swim after the class if so, how did 1 diver end up waiting(?) at the bottom?

Finally my own observations. If indeed this happened. It is questionable why the DI chose to such a site with poor viz for his instruction. It is curious, but uncertain if the mismatched fins on the lady diver was indicative of the standard of dive equipment.

I can't imagine based on the account above that the DI did anything drastically wrong (other than make poor choices?) to directly cause death of his student.

That the victim PROBABLY suffered a heart attack as a result of stress does not mean the DI was responsible nor does it mean that had the DI been with the student he could have prevented / saved the victim.

 

[Gen San Chris]

Very strange story to me, Without a body, the manner of death cannot be determined!
If the viz was so bad, how would the instructor just go back and find the others?
The instructor did not break any Padi rule,just poor judgement!
Maybe Spiderpig does not like the instructor and wants to blacken his name!
Without more real information, no real outcome from this case can ever be known!

 

[wedivebc]

There is such a huge amount of conjecture and suppositions in spiderpigs post that I smell troll.
If this did in fact happen as reported then spiderpig should post the facts as they are known and not jump to conclusions without any evidence.
As such this is a useless thread.

 

[jviehe]

Assuming the report to be accurate its obviously a case of bad judgment on the instructors and divers part. Whoever witnessed the incident or heard about it directly should report it to PADI, not the diving community. I dont really get why divers go or instructors take students into such lousy conditions. There is nothing worth dying for. It cant be fun, so whats the point?

 

[Jan Kruger]

It is always sad to read about divers being lost for whatever reason.If in fact the conditions were that bad, these divers should not have been rushed down there , especially since they apparently did not have much experience as normal open water divers.I am hoping more details will become available about this sad situation.

 

[spiderpig]

My post was EDITED by someone. Body was found thursday morning, autopsy has been conducted.

i do not understand WHY the name and # of the instructor has been edited, this guy already put another diver in a wheelchair 2yrs ago taking him to a deep dive without enough gas and then missing a bunch of deco stops.
Instead of trying to do someting, diving community protects people like him?
Amazing!

wilde100
if you can read russian
Tetis.ru :: Ïðîñìîòð òåìû - ×ðåçâû÷àéíîå ïðîèñøåñòâèå 12 èþëÿ
Tetis.ru :: Ïðîñìîòð òåìû - Îíëàéí-êîíôåðåíöèÿ Äìèòðèÿ Îðëîâà
Tetis.ru :: Ïðîñìîòð òåìû - Ïðî "12 èþëÿ"

DI IS responsible, he took 4 unqualified divers with less then 10 dives into a very stressful waters. 2 almost died, one died for good.
Cops are looking for him, can't find him, he dissapeared. He put his repoert on a public web board. Since then - gone with the wind.

 

[Splash-X]

i do not understand WHY the name and # of the instructor has been edited, this guy already put another diver in a wheelchair 2yrs ago taking him to a deep dive without enough gas and then missing a bunch of deco stops.
Instead of trying to do someting, diving community protects people like him?

By your post it appears your looking to mobilize your own army on Scuba Board to "go after" the instructor in what ever way possible. It would appear to me that you may be too biased in your posts to provide enough detail for us to know what really happened.

I'm not sure if you were involved in the incident or if you just have a negative opinion of the instructor. Either way, we should step back and examine all of the evidence before jumping to conclusions.

 

[jviehe]

The rules:

The purpose of this forum is the promotion of safe diving through the examination and discussion of accidents and incidents; to find lessons we can apply to our own diving.
Accidents, and incidents that could easily have become accidents, can often be used to illustrate actions that lead to injury or death, and their discussion is essential to building lessons learned from which improved safety can flow. To foster the free exchange of information valuable to this process, the "manners" in this forum are much more tightly controlled than elsewhere on the board. In addition to the TOS:

(1) You may not release any names here, until after the names have appeared in the public domain (articles, news reports, sherrif's report etc.) The releasing report must be cited. Until such public release, the only name you may use in this forum is your own.
(2) No flaming, name calling or otherwise attacking other posters. You may attack ideas; you may not attack people.
(3) No trolling; no blamestorming. Mishap analysis does not lay blame, it finds causes.
(4) No "condolences to the family" here
(5) If you are presenting information from a source other than your own eyes and ears, cite the source.
(6) If your post is your hypothesis, theory, or a "possible scenario," identify it as such.
Thanks in advance,
Rick