Sharing air to extend bottom time

[Teamcasa]

Hey Dave it's fine with me if I see you and your wife sharing air, I'll just wave.

LOL! Why not? You have already watched us hold hands! Oops! Maybe that's not PADI approved either - Oh My!

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I still think that any dive guide who initiates an unplanned air sharing when there is no emergency should not be a dive guide. The whole thing would have scared the crap out of me.

Key words- Dive Guide and Unplanned.

I have NEVER advocated that a dive guide do this in a professional roll (unless it is an emergency) or that it done without clearly discussing it BEFORE the dive.

 

[dumpsterDiver]

Devon Diver: The more you argue this, the less convincing you are......LOL...

I'm curious, why is the diver who switches back and forth between his side mount tanks..(to extend his dive)...... oh, I don't know.... "God's gift to diving"... while the diver who switches from his reg. to his buddy's long hose is ..... SATAN?

 

[Mr Carcharodon]

Well then you are exactly the sort of person who should be air sharing at depth. Nothing about sharing air should be scary. You get there through practice

Air sharing at depth is not scary. Being made to share air without previously discussing it when there is no apparent emergency is scary. Refusing to end a dive as per the agreed upon plan is scary. As my guide or buddy you should be 100 percent predictable. Plan your dive and dive your plan. I still day this person should not be a dive guide.

No one was made to share air, the original poster chose to do so. As far as i can tell the OP followed the dive plan only a little later due to the air share which is what she asked about. Personally i think both the op and her buddy gas reserves were too low but she did not ask about that. In the end gas is gas it does not matter a wit who's tank it comes out of.

 

[redacted]

I can imagine those - but, luckily, I can also imagine checking my fill at a point where it can be rectified... and also imagine sidemounting, so that tank size becomes irrelevant for recreational dives.

Anything else irrelevant and solvable I need to ponder over?

I do you figure a diver should do that on a Cozumel 6-pack picking you up at your hotel?

Sidemounting - Great for when you need doubles. But I just don't see much sense in carrying and dealing with 2 full sized tank to conduct a 1-tank dive. If I really needed the redundancy, a small pony would work and be much easier.

 

[windapp]

No one was made to share air, the original poster chose to do so. As far as i can tell the OP followed the dive plan only a little later due to the air share which is what she asked about. Personally i think both the op and her buddy gas reserves were too low but she did not ask about that. In the end gas is gas it does not matter a wit who's tank it comes out of.

Did you not read the original post? What part of this post indicated this was planned? The guide had the smb and refused to deploy it in preparation for assent.

 

[dumpsterDiver]

I do you figure a diver should do that on a Cozumel 6-pack picking you up at your hotel?

Sidemounting - Great for when you need doubles. But I just don't see much sense in carrying and dealing with 2 full sized tank to conduct a 1-tank dive. If I really needed the redundancy, a small pony would work and be much easier.

No you are the customer, you just tell the boat operator to bring two 80 tanks for each dive for each diver... no trouble really..

 

[t4e]

Did you enjoy the extended bottom time or were you too nervous to enjoy it since you didn't have a clue what your divemaster was trying to accomplish? I personally don't like surpises on a dive.

not really, my mind was too preoccupied to try figure out wth is going on

I can imagine those - but, luckily, I can also imagine checking my fill at a point where it can be rectified... and also imagine sidemounting, so that tank size becomes irrelevant for recreational dives.

Anything else irrelevant and solvable I need to ponder over?

with all due respect i don't think sidemounting is for everyone, especially those of us that just wanna go on vacation, do 4-6 dives in a week and look at pretty fishies up to 60ft deep

i do have to ask though...lets assume the events i went through took place while i had a sidemount...what would be your recommendation in that case?

The fact is that 90% of 'rec' divers don't even know what 'gas redundancy' or 'gas planning' is - that's an issue. In fact, it is THE issue that started this thread.

totally wrong, not at all the issue that started this thread

No one was made to share air, the original poster chose to do so. As far as i can tell the OP followed the dive plan only a little later due to the air share which is what she asked about. Personally i think both the op and her buddy gas reserves were too low but she did not ask about that. In the end gas is gas it does not matter a wit who's tank it comes out of.

please do read again my original post

i did not choose to share air, i was made to

 

[trueobelisk]

wow what a thread. healthy discussion i must say.

as a 6’2” 230lbs guy air consumption is near and dear to my heart. on my first 10 dives i was doing 25mins to 30mins bottom time only with shallow dives of about 40 to 50 feet. i felt bad for my dive buddies because they had to deal with that too since we go down as a group and go up as a group as well. so i made it a point to practice my breathing. luckily my efforts have paid off so far - i can do 45mins to 60mins dives now at max depths of 70 feet to 120 feet with 700 to 1000psi left.

as a new diver (i only got my OW cert aug of last year with only 67 dives to my name since then - so i'm nowhere near the experience most of you have) my rule of thumb would always be "safety first." i always tell new divers like me and people i go diving with, don't do something that would put your life at risk no matter how good you are already or no matter how good you think you are. in this case i think sharing of air to increase bottom time is a big risk. there's always a next dive to see the wonders of the underwater world. i could care less if right now you can only do 30mins or less bottom time. if that's your limit at the moment, with your own tank, then that's your limit. practice so you can increase your bottom time. if that person wants to spend 60mins underwater to see more fishies i would gladly do 2 dives with him/her if he/she can’t safely do it in 1 even though i can do it myself. end result is he/she got her 60mins the only difference is it was done in 2 dives instead of 1. eventually you will get better at it and do 60 to 75mins bottom time on one dive with enough air left after the dive (500 to 700psi) to account for emergencies without having to rely on your dive buddy who has better air consumption than you to increase your bottom time. or maybe you won’t, i don’t know, depends perhaps on how determined you are to improve and your physiological make up. obviously, as one of the basic skills everyone should be practicing sharing air from time to time in a controlled environment. that way if the situation comes up you will be comfortable doing it w/o panicking underwater and not end up not endangering your life but that of your dive buddy as well. i firmly believe that's a best practice.

but having said that. i'm all for freedom as well. so if you are fine sharing air to increase your bottom time go for it. if you know what you are doing so be it. it's your life after all. let's just make it clear though that sharing of air by principle as what was thought (i think at least that’s what i learned in CMAS) on all certifying agencies should only be done for emergency purposes. now if a person decides to do it with that in mind then that's on their own dime (and that of the person they are sharing it with). if i’m not comfortable seeing that underwater as part of the dive group because i can’t bear the thought of seeing an accident underwater that might lead to death then i won’t join those guys. if as a dive operator i don’t want my divers doing it then i’ll tell them it’s not acceptable because i don’t want to be responsible if something untoward happens out of that practice. if they insist on doing it then i’ll politely ask them to find some other operator that would allow the practice. bottomline is it’s a matter of choice and principle at that point. just don’t risk another person’s life.

that's just my two cents. i hope i didn't offend anyone. happy diving everyone!

 

[redacted]

Perhaps we should consider this from a bit different angle. Are the skill sets the same for sharing air in an OOA situation, For practicing sharing air, and for sharing air for the purpose of extending dive time? With the possible exception of gas planning, I wou9ld suggest they are.

 

[Fish-R-Man]

I must have been asleep at the wheel........ When did side mount become a standard practice for rec divers? The last I looked, it seemed that the only guys that wouldn't die using it were a select few in cave country!

For the average vacationing diver, to expect them to switch to side mount, just to avoid sharing air is beyond the realm of practicality. I would love to switch my BP/W to side mount instead of using doubles. ( I have a trashed right shoulder that makes operating the valves pretty tough) But, I kind of like having the long hose when I am diving anywhere where I may need to have my OOA buddy may need air until they are securely on the boarding ladder. I have only had to do this once in crappy weather and it worked great. I had enough hose to allow them to get a firm grip without having to worry about getting creamed by the swim step. As far as pre-checking bottles, in places like Cozumel, the dive OP that I dive with gives you the option of them taking your gear with them at the end of the day. They slide into the dock in the morning and off you go. I like to keep mine with me, but most don't. It's set up when you get there in the morning. I have never had an issue with a short fill or a bad Nitrox mix from them, but I could see it happening. By the time you find out about it, your already underway. I am sure that if you had an issue with a tank, that there would be plenty of opportunities to swap one out, even if they didn't have one on board. (another boat, resort shop, etc)

Gear choice, is just that a choice. For most of your average divers that only dive a couple times a year, to switch up gear makes no sense. IMHO, air sharing in the right circomstances makes sense. If nothing else it allows individuals to become accustomed to air sharing. Instead of having to wait until your in an emergency situation, wouldn't it have been more prudent to have at least some practice with the procedure?

DM's sharing air to extend a dive IMHO is not a good practice......