Spear gun and pole spear as a self defense weapon?

[Dirty-Dog]

Dont you keep hoping that some bleeding heart liberal pops their head up here, insisting that mothers everywhere, should not be constantly afraid that their sons will be killed in a burglary attempt?
I'd also settle for the crowd that believes it's wrong to take a life, for any reason.
We could use some more comic relief

View attachment 200604

I am a liberal, and the first in the thread to point out that the spear is a poor choice.
And the picture is photoshopped.


Sent from an old fashioned 300 baud acoustic modem by whistling into the handset. Really.

 

[Z Gear]

I am a liberal, and the first in the thread to point out that the spear is a poor choice.
And the picture is photoshopped.


Sent from an old fashioned 300 baud acoustic modem by whistling into the handset. Really.

Can you elaborate why you think the pole spear is a poor choice? Thanks in advance.

 

[vincent54]

It's not designed as a weapon. The chances are, the assailant will deflect the initial thrust and you'll be beaten or shot by intruder. To eliminate witnesses, your family will be killed.

Buy a Judge with 000 alternating with a .410 slug. Point and shoot. Short spray pattern and the slug is used after the shot incapacitates.(so says my GBI friend)

Or just invest in an alarm system

 

[DennisS]

If you're going to use a spear, get a Manny Puig hog spear, to quote Tim Allen, grr snort, unnh, unnh

 

[pasley]

I thought you were supposed to fire a warning shot before actually shooting the burglar. Sounds like a good way to end up in jail. You be surprised how many people get in trouble for defending themselves. Gotta love today's America .

DISCLAIMER: NOT AN ATTORNEY, LEGAL EXPERT OR SANE PERSON. THE FOLLOWING IS STRICKLLY AN OPONION AND IS NOT TO BE RELIED UPON. CHECK WHITH YOUR STATE FOR THE APPLICABLE GUN LAWS.

Warning shot? Why on earth would you, at a moment when you are "IN FEAR OF YOUR LIFE FROM AN IMMENENT THREAT!" fire a warning shot? I am no legal expert, but I have never heard of this requirement (see disclaimer). Remember, you are in most states permitted to Use Deadly Force IF AND ONLY IF you are 1. In Fear of your life or in fear that others are gong to be harmed. 2. The threat is immanent. 3. The threat has the ability to cause harm/death.

Let's explore the mechanics of a "Warning Shot";
1. Exactly where are you going to aim when you fire they warning shot? Planning of a near flyby with the bullet of the attacker? Shoot the floor? Shoot the ceiling? Shoot the wall? Where are your going to shoot?
2, Warning shot goes through how many walls etc. Remember this bullet is not hitting center mass of target, it is heading downrange undamaged and with full potential energy.
3. Shoot at the floor? Ricochet off cement, tile, or a nail head is a possibility. If you are not on the the lowest floor in the building it may strike someone in the floor below (or basement).
4. Shoot into the ceiling? Put a hole in a perfectly good roof and what goes up, will come down. I have seen several people wounded by bullets falling out of the sky. What if you are not on the top floor of the building? You could shoot someone on the floor above you.
No my friend, firing a warning shot not only puts others down range in danger but communicates to the attacker that you are not willing to take a life and shoot them.

Verbal warning of "Halt Or I Will Shoot" - again check with your local state. I am not a fan of telling an armed intruder who is threating my life or that of others that they better shoot or stab or attack now because if they don't I am going to shoot, in a minute....if I get up the nerve. If they don't get the message when you draw a controlled, steady well aimed at center of mass sight picture on them, then...well they are never going to get the message. I will also tell you that if you say, "STOP! Take one more step and I will shoot", the response may just be, "Go ahead and shoot" as then continue towards you. (personal experience). So I don't recommend it.

Personal definition of a warning shot....the first and last shot fired that leaves me to explain to the police how the intruder died.

 

[emeshuris]

Warning shot, what you don't do.

 

[Dirty-Dog]

Can you elaborate why you think the pole spear is a poor choice? Thanks in advance.

I already did, in my first reply.

The goal is to stop the threat as quickly as possible. A spear is unlikely to do so. Even a single gunshot is unlikely to do so (which is why defensive shooting training is never single shot...).

And, bluntly, you don't know how to use that spear as a weapon. Using it against a person is not at all the same as using it against a fish. A fish, for example, won't block, and take it away from you. Or shoot you 3-4 times while you're trying to get close enough to poke at them.

---------- Post added January 3rd, 2015 at 08:36 PM ----------

I thought you were supposed to fire a warning shot before actually shooting the burglar. Sounds like a good way to end up in jail. You be surprised how many people get in trouble for defending themselves. Gotta love today's America .

Warning shots only happen in movies. That warning shot is going to hit something...

 

[Dupetones]

DISCLAIMER: NOT AN ATTORNEY, LEGAL EXPERT OR SANE PERSON. THE FOLLOWING IS STRICKLLY AN OPONION AND IS NOT TO BE RELIED UPON. CHECK WHITH YOUR STATE FOR THE APPLICABLE GUN LAWS.

Warning shot? Why on earth would you, at a moment when you are "IN FEAR OF YOUR LIFE FROM AN IMMENENT THREAT!" fire a warning shot? I am no legal expert, but I have never heard of this requirement (see disclaimer). Remember, you are in most states permitted to Use Deadly Force IF AND ONLY IF you are 1. In Fear of your life or in fear that others are gong to be harmed. 2. The threat is immanent. 3. The threat has the ability to cause harm/death.

Let's explore the mechanics of a "Warning Shot";
1. Exactly where are you going to aim when you fire they warning shot? Planning of a near flyby with the bullet of the attacker? Shoot the floor? Shoot the ceiling? Shoot the wall? Where are your going to shoot?
2, Warning shot goes through how many walls etc. Remember this bullet is not hitting center mass of target, it is heading downrange undamaged and with full potential energy.
3. Shoot at the floor? Ricochet off cement, tile, or a nail head is a possibility. If you are not on the the lowest floor in the building it may strike someone in the floor below (or basement).
4. Shoot into the ceiling? Put a hole in a perfectly good roof and what goes up, will come down. I have seen several people wounded by bullets falling out of the sky. What if you are not on the top floor of the building? You could shoot someone on the floor above you.
No my friend, firing a warning shot not only puts others down range in danger but communicates to the attacker that you are not willing to take a life and shoot them.

Verbal warning of "Halt Or I Will Shoot" - again check with your local state. I am not a fan of telling an armed intruder who is threating my life or that of others that they better shoot or stab or attack now because if they don't I am going to shoot, in a minute....if I get up the nerve. If they don't get the message when you draw a controlled, steady well aimed at center of mass sight picture on them, then...well they are never going to get the message. I will also tell you that if you say, "STOP! Take one more step and I will shoot", the response may just be, "Go ahead and shoot" as then continue towards you. (personal experience). So I don't recommend it.

Personal definition of a warning shot....the first and last shot fired that leaves me to explain to the police how the intruder died.

Lol. Wow. Feel better?

---------- Post added January 4th, 2015 at 03:43 AM ----------

I never said I would fire a warning shot. I just thought in done areas you had to. Personally, I would shoot to kill, slice,chop,and grind, bleach, and a small camp fire. No more burglar.

 

[Z Gear]

It's not designed as a weapon. The chances are, the assailant will deflect the initial thrust and you'll be beaten or shot by intruder. To eliminate witnesses, your family will be killed.

Buy a Judge with 000 alternating with a .410 slug. Point and shoot. Short spray pattern and the slug is used after the shot incapacitates.(so says my GBI friend)

Or just invest in an alarm system

This is where you are very mistaken. It is not a gun but it is still a weapon and can be lethal. Let me fully explain this to you and others who are not certain of this. The spear has been used as a weapon just as the battle ax and the sword have for centuries. The pole spear especially the one I have an aluminum pole spear is very similar to what an authentic spear is like. I agree that I have only used to hunt fish and I have not trained to use it for defense purposes but it doesn't mean I can't do so in the future. Training to use something like a spear for self defense is a little different but it can be done.

Although you were mistaken about the definition of what a weapon is:A weapon, arm, or armament is any device used in order to inflict damage or harm to living beings, structures, or systems. Weapons are used to increase the efficacy and efficiency of activities such as hunting, crime, law enforcement, self-defense, andwarfare. In a broader context, weapons may be construed to include anything used to gain a strategic, material or mental advantage over an adversary.

I can agree with you that the experience using it on only fish is not sufficient experience to qualify as an effective measure against an intruder. Only after training with this as a self defense weapon will it then have the merits of being an effective means of protection from an intruder. Even though I don't want to admit it I was wrong in some areas and I am glad you gave us your inputs.

I want to take this opportunity to thank all those who chimed in, at first I didn't like some of the responses because I didn't want to really look at it from their view point. After thinking some of these over I have come to the following conclusion. Please correct me if you think I'm wrong about this.

First off with out a doubt the weapon of choice for home defense should be a gun or in my opinion a shot gun. That being said I did make it clear that at the present time I could not have a gun in my home and that others could also have restrictions of their own.

Here the important, part the purpose of the thread was since we are all divers and we are chiming in at the HUNTING forum most of us have these items. The intention was to look at this the way you use a base ball bat, hunting knife or other items some use as a home defense weapon. It is a practical and resourceful approach which is what my message was about.

The importance of training when using any weapon can not be ignored and I can see this now. The scenario of hunting a fish and defending ones self are very different so it would be unreasonable for me not to recognize this fact. For now the only thing that I can do is find a way to train with the pole spear.
I think this can be done. The poster above was right(hate to admit!!!) it is quite possible that the initial thrust move can be deflected and it could work against me. Training is the only way to over come this risk. Finding this kind of training will be my next objective. Only because I can not have a gun in my house at this time.I have to thank those noting this because it was not apparent to me until some one brought it up.

I didn't want to bring to much division, after all we all dive and hunt (fish). As hunters we probably have an edge over some in protecting ourselves whether its with a gun or other means. We probably have nerve, we probably won't hesitate and when we need to act, and I can tell most of you are disciplined in training and I can respect that. Some of you were blunt, I can handle that. The truth is there is a lot of qualities we all share in common, I just want to remind everyone of that.

 

[Dirty-Dog]

This is where you are very mistaken. It is not a gun but it is still a weapon and can be lethal. Let me fully explain this to you and others who are not certain of this. The spear has been used as a weapon just as the battle ax and the sword have for centuries. The pole spear especially the one I have an aluminum pole spear is very similar to what an authentic spear is like. I agree that I have only used to hunt fish and I have not trained to use it for defense purposes but it doesn't mean I can't do so in the future. Training to use something like a spear for self defense is a little different but it can be done.

You are incorrect. It is completely different. Not a little differrent.

Although you were mistaken about the definition of what a weapon is:A weapon, arm, or armament is any device used in order to inflict damage or harm to living beings, structures, or systems. Weapons are used to increase the efficacy and efficiency of activities such as hunting, crime, law enforcement, self-defense, andwarfare. In a broader context, weapons may be construed to include anything used to gain a strategic, material or mental advantage over an adversary.

Sorry, I must have missed where anybody said a spear isn't a weapon. Of course it is. It's just a terrible choice for home defense, especially in the hands of someone with no actual training in it's use as a weapon.

I can agree with you that the experience using it on only fish is not sufficient experience to qualify as an effective measure against an intruder. Only after training with this as a self defense weapon will it then have the merits of being an effective means of protection from an intruder. Even though I don't want to admit it I was wrong in some areas and I am glad you gave us your inputs.

And where do you plan to get this training?

And you've still to address the issue of how you intend to secure this weapon to prevent your children (and other peoples children) from accessing it.

I want to take this opportunity to thank all those who chimed in, at first I didn't like some of the responses because I didn't want to really look at it from their view point. After thinking some of these over I have come to the following conclusion. Please correct me if you think I'm wrong about this.

First off with out a doubt the weapon of choice for home defense should be a gun or in my opinion a shot gun. That being said I did make it clear that at the present time I could not have a gun in my home and that others could also have restrictions of their own.

Well, no, you CHOOSE not to have a gun, prefering instead to rely on a less suitable weapon that requires more training to use properly. Training which you don't have.

Here the important, part the purpose of the thread was since we are all divers and we are chiming in at the HUNTING forum most of us have these items. The intention was to look at this the way you use a base ball bat, hunting knife or other items some use as a home defense weapon. It is a practical and resourceful approach which is what my message was about.

No, it is an impractical and poor resource to use for home defense.
Here's a hint. I have 40+ years of martial arts training, including a shodan in Shorin-Ryu Kenjutsu (that's an art that focuses on the use of the katana). I have no shortage of edged weapons in the house and am quite proficient in their use as weapons.
But if a bad guy kicks in my door, I'm not planing to grab a katana.

The importance of training when using any weapon can not be ignored and I can see this now. The scenario of hunting a fish and defending ones self are very different so it would be unreasonable for me not to recognize this fact. For now the only thing that I can do is find a way to train with the pole spear.
I think this can be done. The poster above was right(hate to admit!!!) it is quite possible that the initial thrust move can be deflected and it could work against me. Training is the only way to over come this risk. Finding this kind of training will be my next objective. Only because I can not have a gun in my house at this time.I have to thank those noting this because it was not apparent to me until some one brought it up.

And what's your plan for dealing with the bad guys gun? It's unlikely it's going to be spear vs spear....

I didn't want to bring to much division, after all we all dive and hunt (fish). As hunters we probably have an edge over some in protecting ourselves whether its with a gun or other means. We probably have nerve, we probably won't hesitate and when we need to act, and I can tell most of you are disciplined in training and I can respect that. Some of you were blunt, I can handle that. The truth is there is a lot of qualities we all share in common, I just want to remind everyone of that.

I'm guessing your experience of human vs human violence is pretty limited. Let me assure you that hunting, be it fish or animals, in no way whatsoever prepares you for facing a person who is trying to kill you. Especially if you insist on brining a knife (or spear) to a gun fight.

Good luck with your plan. I really hope you never have to find out why it's not really a good plan.