U.S. Not Doing Enough to Protect Coral Reefs

[Boogie711]

Do I consider myself an environmentalist? Yes.
Do I think there's a problem with overconsumption? No.
Do I think there's a problem with the Kyoto protocol? ABSOLUTELY.
Do I think we need to worry about global warming at all? No.

For example, if you had read the reports I highlighted in the IPCC, you would see a few notable facts.

- Only about 0.03 percent of the Earth's atmosphere consists of carbon dioxide (nitrogen, oxygen, and argon constitute about 78 percent, 20 percent, and 0.93 percent of the atmosphere, respectively).

- Most of the carbon dioxide in the atmosphere does not come from the burning of fossil fuels. Only about 14 percent of it does.

- The claims that the earth has been heating up this century? Most of 20th Century global warming occurred in the first few decades of that century, before the widespread burning of fossil fuels (and before 82 percent of the increase in atmospheric CO2 observed in the 20th Century.)
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Here's me in a nutshell - I believe that human beings will naturally buy prosperity, then buy environment. I'm a market environmentalist.

Take a look at the USA. The USA is, for the most part, in BETTER shape than it was 50 years ago. Air quality is improving. Water quality is improving. Mortality rates are dramatically higher.

For the most part, it's because the USA has invested in their environment. No one likes to live in a pig sty. And over the next 30 years, countries like India and China are going to follow suit. Africa is going to take a while, but it will happen.

Go ahead and reference the Dodo bird - the fact is, we're not dying in childbirth or of measles or smallpox anymore, are we? People tend to focus on the horror stories. It's natural - activist groups need us to focus on the horror stories so they can pay their salaries or for their multi-million dollar office headquarters. But really folks - things are looking up.

The best way to protect the environment is to go shopping.

 

[armyscuba]

We have some fine and Very Healthy Coral Reefs here in Cuba...on a positive note..no politics to mention...I just like to Dive..

 

[archman]

Most of the carbon dioxide in the atmosphere does not come from the burning of fossil fuels. Only about 14 percent of it does.

How solid is that figure Boogie? That's way higher than I believed it to be, and the ecologist is screaming "significant impact". This may represent the high end that the "other half" of climate scientists are using to fuel their global warming calculations.

You don't happen to have the percentages for methane do you?

 

[archman]

We have some fine and Very Healthy Coral Reefs here in Cuba...on a positive note..no politics to mention...I just like to Dive..

Yeah, there's a superb reason those Cuban reefs are so great... you get three guesses. Hint: it's the same reason the Flower Gardens Banks are similarly pristine.

 

[calypsonick]

Go ahead and reference the Dodo bird - the fact is, we're not dying in childbirth or of measles or smallpox anymore, are we? People tend to focus on the horror stories. It's natural - activist groups need us to focus on the horror stories so they can pay their salaries or for their multi-million dollar office headquarters. But really folks - things are looking up.

So, if it ain't broke don't fix it?!?!?



Isn’t that the point ? By eradicating these diseases, we have created a population explosion that is growing at phenomenal rates. Don’t get me wrong, I am glad that I don’t have to worry about my daughter getting smallpox (only malaria, dengue fever and Japanese encephalitis here in Timor) but must we wait until we HAVE TO DO SOMETHING because are all in living in cesspools?



Side note - It would be interesting to see a table comparing the cost of extractive industry (eg: petroleum, mining, timber) company office headquarters and their profit margins with those of environmental activist groups.

 

[armyscuba]

Yeah, there's a superb reason those Cuban reefs are so great... you get three guesses. Hint: it's the same reason the Flower Gardens Banks are similarly pristine.

ANSWER: Because nobody can get near them to ruin them...I recently did a Dive at Cuzco Beach, Cuba..(History) June 6, 1898. Guantanamo Bay awoke to the sound of gunfire from the cruiser USS Marblehead as Commander B.H. McCalla ordered his guns to engage the Spanish positions on the hill that would eventually bear his name. This was the only location of freshwater in the area. This location is still protected today by the Naval Base. It was opened for one day recently to our Dive Club for a Beach Clean-up and Dive. It has been closed for two years. Talk about gorgeous...just incredible how beautiful the Dive was. Once again though a very rare experience and only 20 or so people were there to experience it. My point being Look but don't touch....Visit...take pictures..move on..remember the feeling..

 

[Boogie711]

Archman - for methane and other numbers, I would refer you to http://cdiac.esd.ornl.gov/pns/current_ghg.html as a starting point.

As for the 14% total, there has been a 22% total increase in CO levels over the last 100 years... but that would assume that all of that increase is directly attributable to burning fossil fuels, and that's simply unrealistic. For a detailed explanation, go to http://cdiac.esd.ornl.gov/pns/faq.html.

And Calypsonick - the demographic numbers I've seen all seem to indicate that the worlds population is going to peak at around 2040 to 2050, and then steadily decrease as these now-prosperous African, Indian and Chinese women decide to focus on careers and stop having babies. I'm not being facetious - it's based on historic trend analysis. You can yell and wave your arms all you want about "population explosion" - ask yourself - why are we having an explosion in the first place?

The answer is - because we're not being killed off by easily fixed problems, like Malaria or smallpox. We are better off than our ancestors were, because we spend our way out of living in cesspools. We buy prosperity, and then we buy environment, because it's a lifestyle issue. No one wants to live in a cesspool, so we fix them. It's a basic concept which you don't seem willing to grasp. The best way to help the environment is to go out and spend money.

By the way - I'll defend petrochemical or forestry industry profit's any day of the week and twice on Sundays. That keyboard you're typing on is plastic. It's inside your house, made of wood. Trust me - that's not a road you really want to venture down.

 

[chrisch]

Boogie, Is that right about Bush and biodiesel?? (yes of course or you wouldn't post it). Please tell him to get the EU on the case. I'm coughing my guts up in the diesel fumes here in Italy...
Seriously, I am pleased to hear it and was not aware that it had been subsidised in the US (home of the "free market" ho ho). It is a little bit of a hobby horse of mine and the more of it we have the better. In Europe our idiot politicians pay farmers to leave fields unsown to artificialy raise grain prices. This is part of a policy designed to "help" farming, but turns the farmers into subsidy junkies. Anything that we can do to return that land to production is good and biofuel would be an obvious use..

Not sure about going shopping though. Does that include buying scuba gear?

Chris

 

[Boogie711]

In all fairness, a lot of the subsidies come from the various State governments, but there are some big time subsidies going on in the biofuels industry in the good old US of A. It's frustrating because I'm working with a number of groups at getting an ethanol refinery in Ontario, and the economic climate just isn't favourable because there are better subsidies in the USA.

Just down the road from me, the City of Brampton, Ontario, runs their municipal fleet (buses, graders, construction vehicles, etc.) on a biodiesel blend. But they have to import their biodiesel from the States, because there are no Canadian suppliers.

 

[calypsonick]

The answer is - because we're not being killed off by easily fixed problems, like Malaria or smallpox. We are better off than our ancestors were, because we spend our way out of living in cesspools. We buy prosperity, and then we buy environment, because it's a lifestyle issue. No one wants to live in a cesspool, so we fix them. It's a basic concept which you don't seem willing to grasp. The best way to help the environment is to go out and spend money.

I concede, Boogie, you are always right!! We must spend our way into the cesspool stage and then be required to fix it regardless of the environmental costs of putting some more species in the history books with our friend the Dodo.