Was this a terrible idea, or merely a bad idea?

[Steve_C]

What a person knows or does not know when you dive with them is only somewhat correlated with what they are taught. I teach in a university and I have 100s of examples of where I know they have been taught X but have not used it for a couple years and no longer remember X. Any instructor who assumes that every student they teach will remember everything two years later, unless the student keeps learning, is naive.

On a personal note in my senior year in college I was taking an advanced math course and saw the definition of a limit. I thought it was a new idea and learned it (and still know it). A little later I was looking at my freshman calculus book and found the definition of limit: underlined in black, highlighted in yellow, blue box around it, and three red stars in the margin (no exaggeration) Most highlighted thing in the text. Apparently I had memorized it my Freshman year. But not using it, had filed away and forgotten.

 

[boulderjohn]

So a dive like the OP's would have met PADI standards if the diver had first signed up for the AOW course, done a Fish ID dive or some such easy dive as the first dive of the course, and been just 10 feet shallower. I'm not trying to bash PADI (too easy a target), just trying to put things in perspective.

Correct.

The reason for the rule against it being the first dive is so they can get to know you before taking you to 100 feet. If you have a diver with a really bad SAC rate, if you have a diver who is prone to panic, if you have a diver who can.t clear the mask without sprinting to the surface, you don't want to discover that for the first time at 100 feet.

 

[Rhone Man]

The discussion provides more drama than the dive.

This is the joy of "discussions" on the internet.

 

[DogDiver]

Hope you had a great time. I see nothing wrong with that particular dive. He__, I did my first certified dive 6 years after I was diving.

 

[dlofting]

We did that dive too with PADI OW certifications only. I think it was around my 15th or 20th dive but not my first with that particular dive shop. They made sure we understood the symptoms of narcosis and understood that our NDL at the depth of the wreck would be 12-13 minutes max...we planned to send 10 minutes at the wreck, starting at the bottom and working our way up to the highest point. The DM's hung a tank and reg under the boat as a contingency for a safety stop or for deco. As in your case, everything went off without a hitch. I agree with NetDoc that it's probably the most benign 110 ft dive I'll ever do.

 

[CuzzA]

Correct.

The reason for the rule against it being the first dive is so they can get to know you before taking you to 100 feet. If you have a diver with a really bad SAC rate, if you have a diver who is prone to panic, if you have a diver who can.t clear the mask without sprinting to the surface, you don't want to discover that for the first time at 100 feet.

I recall for AOW doing the deep dive first since we're supposed to do our deepest dives first for repetitive diving. 3 that day. Is that a rule for instructors if they don't know the student?

 

[mark01]

I personally saw this very same sort of dive go south and participated in the rescue which culminated in a chamber ride to the tune of $28,000. New diver, second dive following certification, great viz, no current, 111' on the wreck....it was a "trust me" dive. **** happens and water always wins.

 

[Macan]

I recall for AOW doing the deep dive first since we're supposed to do our deepest dives first for repetitive diving. 3 that day. Is that a rule for instructors if they don't know the student?

Below is a direct quote from the PADI Instructor Manual:

"In preparation for the dive and before beginning open water dive skills, assess the diver’s skills and comfort level inwater and generally assess dive knowledge. If the diver exhibits lack of dive readiness, remediate before training progresses.

Recent dive experience with the diver is acceptable as a screen if you are confident in the diver’s current knowledge level, inwater skills and comfort.

If you do not have recent dive experience with the diver, in preparation for the dive, generally assess diver knowledge, and, before going to depth in open water, evaluate the diver inwater for prerequisite skills needed to complete the Deep Dive."

What John said earlier is correct. The OPs training is from SSI, not PADI. If this was a PADI Instructor, he would have been in violation of standards and could be expelled.

While a dive to that wreck may be generally known as an easy dive as other have posted, I don't think any of us would want our family member who has just completed the Open Water course to:

- dive to 110 feet, and

- be under the care of a Pro who may not know the student's diving skill (not pertaining to this case specifically).

 

[drrich2]

I'm glad you now understand the issues involved, and have seen something of the variety of views people have on 'trust me' dives. Yes, you are in a dependent position, reliant on the professional's judgment, and that carries risk.

On the other hand, you probably got to Roatan by commercial flight. A 'trust me' flight. You got in a giant metal tube, let a stranger take you up thousands of feet & blast you through the sky in a device you likely lacked the knowledge to operate and probably without a parachute in case things really went south.

My point is, most of us periodically knowingly consent to a variety of 'trust me' experience, where we place ourselves to some extent in the hands of those we believe are able to provide an acceptable degree of risk control for a desired service. When, why, what and under what circumstances one chooses to do so is a personal decision.

Richard.

 

[perry64]

Any instructor who assumes that every student they teach will remember everything two years later, unless the student keeps learning, is naive.

The term used in the instructional system design literature is "skill decay." Any skill not practiced will decay. However, each time you refresh your knowledge of the topic, the speed at which your knowledge decays is reduced. This is why those of you who have 1000's of dives can, after not having dove for a significant length of time, discuss all sort of diving minutia or still dive incredibly well.

This article has a great graph demonstrating it - the one in yellow, about halfway down, titled "Projected Forgetting Curve."