what reasons have you seen people not pass certifications?

[Donald D]

Not to take this topic of course, but I'm very curious at how many have failed the course that have taken discover scuba. The first time I did discover scuba, I fell in love with the sport - I also sucked at it too but I would not let my anxiety get the best of me. 2 years later, I've done the discovery course two more time, currently taking swim lessons (working on the 200 yards without fins, but can successfully swim 300 yards with fins and snorkel), and studying for my cert. for the end of March.

From reading many of the post, it may literally be the first time with the dive equipment for those that don't make it. - I'm just a little curious about this...

 

[MXGratefulDiver]

I wouldn't be too concerned, Donald ... I really sucked at scuba diving when I first started. I'm one of those people that nothing came easily for ... tons of people with less experience than me did way better at it ... and that continues today with every new class I take.

But if you love doing it, get out and work at getting better ... you'll amaze yourself with how far you can progress with a bit of practice, patience, and persistence ...

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

 

[paddler3d]

Hey Donald, everyone sucks in the beginning...that is the whole point of taking the class. They even suck when they are done with the class. It takes time and practice.

You don't get a drivers license and then hop in and drive a race car, we'll maybe some do.

 

[boulderjohn]

My understanding when my wife bailed on OW dives three and four was that she got a Scuba Diver card because she had completed the first two dives.

Are you saying you get a SD card even if you don't complete any of the dives? I was under the impression you could only get a referral in that situation.

You have to complete two OW dives and the related skills for the SD certification.

 

[tbone1004]

we require ditch and don's for our OW students as well as a 800yd circuit swim. 400 swim 400 kick that's timed. That's a large reason for students not going to OWT. If our students make it to OWT which is usually about 90% of them, they'll pass. Usually we stop them before they get to OW, then give them the option to come back for stuff in the next semester. Works out pretty well. Their skills are pretty good and unless someone just freaks out in open water which has happened, they'll pass. Usually when they freak out it's because they are used to a warm clear pool instead of a 50-60 degree quarry with 10 feet of visibility. At that point we'll take em one on one and ease em in, and they'll usually calm down. The last one this happened to ended up wicked excited the next day, just was jumpy day 1.

 

[midwayman]

I've seen people not pass due to being unable to complete the swim tests
I've seen people not pass due to just deciding "its not for them"

The strangest one I've seen is people getting booted from a class because they were 'too slow' in a small class. Coincidentally they were the only ones who bought their gear online instead of from the shop.

 

[boulderjohn]

I think this is a dangerous and arrogant attitude to use for instruction.

Anyone who desires to go underwater can achieve that goal and become certified. In paddler3d's inaccurate description of the events as they pertained to his 68YO student, even this gentleman could have achieved his goals under the proper instruction and if needed, proper accomodations.

On the day of panic, had he had a good DM or Instructor with him, he would have calmed down and completed his certification. A discussion about panic would have been had and how to deal with it and maybe even a discussion about accomodations for diving with his knee condition.

I suspect that Paddler3d's description of the events was probably very accurate, unless you know something I don't about the specific incident. I suspect that he did tell someone who wanted to try again and keep at it until he got it that he was not fit for scuba. I am sure he did send him packing.

It is inaccurate in that it does not reflect the educational philosophies of almost all agencies today. It is along the lines of what I described earlier:

He disagreed, arguing that scuba standards should be rigorous, students should not even start instruction until they could meet certain high standards, and the operation with which he was associated was doing students a service by weeding out the unfit early. If someone has that philosophy, they will not only experience a high failure rate, they will be proud of it.

He is certainly proud of the way he weeded out that unfit individual.

I do find it interesting though, that he uses the word the "arrogant" to describe a philosophy that says "we'll keep working with you as long as you are willing to keep on trying." He obviously feels that it is not arrogant to tell students that they are hopelessly unfit for scuba and they should quit immediately.

 

[Skydiver1]

I have a friend who get certified in Cuba. He hated every minute of it and had alot of difficulty with all skills etc. He had a panic attack on his last open water dive and bolted to the surface. He still got his certification card, but claims to have "misplaced" it somewhere and has never dived since. Even on a trip to the Keys with a group last month, he would go off by himself during the day while everyone else was diving,.

 

[Max Speed]

I've heard you can be flunked for combining the words "spare" and "air" in a single sentence.

 

[paddler3d]

I've heard you can be flunked for combining the words "spare" and "air" in a single sentence.

You don't flunk. You just end up dead and cause a whole rehash of the SA argument on SB.