Worth extra $ for air intergrated computer?

[bluesbro1982]

Just lurking, but this has made me think.

is this thread about Wireless AI being unreliable, or ALL AI being unreliable (From those that suggest that you need a SPG no matter what). Reason I ask is that I was thinking of getting a Suunto Cobra (Hosed, with AI obviously), but now I wonder if I need it at all...

 

[bperrybap]

Back to your original questions:

Alot of what works for you will come down to personal
preferences, budget, and how you like to view and use things.
Obviously, from reading this thread, there are a lot of
different personal preferences and opinions.

Some things to consider.
- How many different devices do you want to have to look at
to get the data you want/need?

- How important is it that all the data be viewable in a single device
or a device that can be operated with 1 hand?
i.e. how much data do you want/need to see at the same time?

Having a wrist mouned non AI computer like Atmos 2 means
looking at potentially 3 different "devices":
SPG (air pressure), Computer (depth, NTIME), and compass.

A full console, with non Air integrated computer, like
the Aeris Atmos 2 console while larger,
will put all of that in 1 place. Computer, SPG, Compass.

A fully integrated wireless wrist mount like the Aeris Elite
puts 2 of three on your wrist. You would still need a seperate
compass. (Although some newer Suunto devices do
have electronic compasses built in)

A full AI computer with compass option such as the Aeris AI
can put all 3 three in a very compact package.

Many Hoseless AI computers can also be put into a boot
and attached to a retractor. Some have a compass option
which puts all the data into a single location.


- Front & Back 3 gauge consoles:
Units like the XR 2 3 guage console or the
Oceanic Veo 250 console have 2 gauges on 1 side and 1 on the
other. This will require flipping the console around while diving.
While it does make the console smaller, it is kind of pain to
be constantly flipping the console over. Pay close attention to
this type because the placement of the gauges is different with
different models.
With the XR2 console you can see compass and depth at the same
time, yet with the Veo 250, you cannot.
With the Veo 250 console, it is impossible to see depth and
compass heading at the same time. Veo has compass on back
while XR2 has SPG on back.
Also, while it may seem easy to flip while looking at it on the
shelf, try it under pressure when hooked up to a tank. It
takes a good bit of force to rotate it.

--------------------------------------------------------------------
It all boils down to personal preferences & budget.
AI costs more money. Hoseless adds even more cost.

Only you can decide what you like and how much extra those
features are worth to you given your budget.

Me personally, I have an Aeris AI. I like the AI capabilities.
I also like having a very small package that contains everything.
I can see everything I want/need including compass at the
same time which I like for navigation.
I don't care for units like the Veo250 3 Gauge console.
I like to be able to see depth and my compass at the same time.
But remember these are just my perferences. Yours may
be completely different.

Hope that helps.

--- bill

 

[Soggy]

my BMW warns when it says i have 30 miles left. as a driver, i know it is based on my current avg mpg and estimated amount of fuel i have in my tank. if the next gas station is 35 miles, i can drive conservatively, turn off ac, accel downhill and coast uphill to reach that 35 mile gas station. and with experience, i know about how much i can squeeze out of that 30 miles remaining alarm. so its a useful indicator, and not intended as an exact measurement (hence not faulty, imo).

How is that useful? I can do the same thing with my tripometer, fuel gauge, and a little familiarity with my car. In fact, I have a little low fuel light that goes off. Inevitably, I say to myself, "that light is going to go off soon" and within 5-10 miles, sure enough, I get the light. Thus, it serves no purpose. The reality of it is that when that light goes off, I know I have about 1.5 gallons of fuel left, so I end up cutting things closer than I might normally if the light weren't there at all and I just saw "E" approaching.

 

[SpiderSense]

How is that useful? I can do the same thing with my tripometer, fuel gauge, and a little familiarity with my car. In fact, I have a little low fuel light that goes off. Inevitably, I say to myself, "that light is going to go off soon" and within 5-10 miles, sure enough, I get the light. Thus, it serves no purpose. The reality of it is that when that light goes off, I know I have about 1.5 gallons of fuel left, so I end up cutting things closer than I might normally if the light weren't there at all and I just saw "E" approaching.

because sometimes you get caught off guard.. hence alarms 'help'. its not an answer to fixing people's problems. if i'm monitoring my gauge like i'm supposed to, i don't 'need' the alarm. but its nice knowing its there and can help in some cases. if i'm not monitoring as i'm supposed to, i'm more likely going to get stuck on the side of the road (or out of air) without an alarm. many of my friends run out of gas on the motorcycle since they don't have fuel gauges. they failed to monitor their gas gauge or failed to estimate their gas usage correctly for that tank. it just happens, even to alert, responsible people. especially in situations where gas usage (car or diving) varies, i feel an alarm is a good thing.

my argument was whether the 'indicator' was faulty or conservative, not if its useful to everyone (it is to me).

 

[Soggy]

Fortunately running out of gas while driving probably won't kill you, and thus you don't need to take it as seriously, but what possible reason would there be to not be monitoring your gauges underwater? I can't think of any. Someone who gets that distracted underwater should take up golf...really. (I'm not a golf player, so maybe that's a bad analogy...no offense to golf players).

Here are some tricks:
1) Get a wrist mounted gauge for depth and bottom time
2) Check your depth and time often (it's easy because it's on your wrist). I probably check my depth every 10-15 seconds
3) This is the big one: Every 5 minutes, check your pressure. Before you check it, estimate what it will be, then verify with the gauge. Just do this on the 5s and 10s. That way you get a very good feel for your gas usage over a period of time.

 

[SpiderSense]

yeah i dont know. i'm not a very experienced diver. or motorcyclist. but i read stories about people running out of air. heck, we practiced ooa in the classes and even carry an octopus or pony bottles. maybe suddenly leaked at the first stage and didn't know it. i know on the motorcycle i get gas as soon as that light comes on since my mileage varies from 20mpg to over 50mpg with an average of 28mpg. i don't always remember how i ran the bike the day before.

 

[Soggy]

yeah i dont know. i'm not a very experienced diver. or motorcyclist. but i read stories about people running out of air. heck, we practiced ooa in the classes and even carry an octopus or pony bottles. maybe suddenly leaked at the first stage and didn't know it. i know on the motorcycle i get gas as soon as that light comes on since my mileage varies from 20mpg to over 50mpg with an average of 28mpg. i don't always remember how i ran the bike the day before.

I added some stuff to my post above, but only fools just run out of gas because they weren't paying attention. Again, those people should take up golf or seriously reevaluate their planning skills. It is a completely unjustifiable thing to ever happen.

What can happen is a failure that either prevents access to your gas or dumps it. 5 minute SPG checks will tell you if you are using gas quicker than you expect and anything so bad that it takes less than 5 minutes to exhaust your gas supply would be pretty darn obvious (freeflowing regulator, tank oring failure, burst disk failure, exploding scuba tank, etc).

I just don't see the benefit of alarms. If someone can't pay attention to 3 numbers (tank pressure, depth, time), they need a new hobby. And, so far, that's the only benefit I've heard regarding AI computers.

 

[halocline]

So where can I get a good brass SPG on a 24" hose for $60?

 

[Soggy]

So where can I get a good brass SPG on a 24" hose for $60?

Normally from me, but I'm waiting on an order to come in. If you can wait a month, I'll probably have them.

 

[cummings66]

And, so far, that's the only benefit I've heard regarding AI computers.

To me and I'll say it again, it's been posted a couple times. The main benefit is that it records my tank pressures for me allowing me to log them at a later date for air consumption analysis.

I can do the same thing if I want.

You could argue a computer isn't even needed which is what you posted a bit ago, simple watch, depth gage, and SPG are all you need.

People use them for convenience, sometimes as a crutch. So, for me it all depends on what you're going to use it for. In any event you'd treat a failure of it or one of it's parts like you would treat a failure of the steam gage.