Accepting Responsibility for Your Own Safety

[boulderjohn]

While I agree that OW divers should be able to dive unsupervised in conditions similar to the conditions under which they were certified, I also think most OW divers are certified under pretty benign conditions. Even if the conditions were fairly difficult, there are always more difficult conditions, and there are more complex plans possible than are normally taught in recreational diving. Even though I had dived in many locations around the world, it was only relatively recently that I did a dive where dealing with tides made a difference, and I was very glad I had knowledgeable local friends to guide me to good decisions. I am sure that if those friends had visited me and done a dive with me at 11,600 feet, I could have returned the favor with some tips on dealing with altitude. There are dive plans where good gas management skills and related knowledge are vital. I think that in many locations an unsupervised diver needs to know about dive flag rules, and in other places they should know how to deploy an SMB. A lot of emergency preparedness information is good to know.

And so, diving unsupervised can entail a lot of skills and knowledge not usually taught in dive classes. Consequently, I created PADI distinctive specialty in advanced dive planning. It covers pretty much everything I could think of that might be necessary. I made the outline freely available to ScubaBoard instructors when I made it, and quite a few took me up on it. It is possible that an instructor near you might have submitted it and will thus be authorized to teach it.

 

[Jim Lapenta]

My last rescue class had 8 students - 4 buddy teams. Maybe it's because some of those had also taken my OW and AOW or just AOW class and therefore had some rescue training to start along with one diver who has a PSD cert, but had any one of them given me any indication that they were not capable of rescuing a fellow diver, their buddy, or themselves after the class they would not have been issued a Rescue Diver card.

By standards I could not have done it and I would have been seriously questioning my class. By our standards I can't cert an open water student who is not capable of rescuing a panicked diver, bring an unconscious diver up from depth, and support a fellow diver at the surface and help them drop weights. I expect them to be able to assist me if need be on checkout dives.

Rescue is indeed in my mind more about having the awareness to prevent accidents before they happen but it is also about being able to respond appropriately when it is needed and a Rescue Diver card says they can. Otherwise they have no business having it. It is not an uw photography cert where if they screw up they can just reshoot and keep practicing. Rescue is about people not dying. And rank and file, non professional divers seeing to that. In order to do that they need to demonstrate a level of awareness of themselves, other divers, and the environment they are in that is hopefully far above the new, or even experienced, open water diver. That would seem to be a priority in the final assesment and evaluation of a rescue class student. If that is not the case that student should not be issued a card.

It is one thing to excuse a new diver for being so fascinated with the underwater environment that they lose track of time, depth, and even their air. It really should not happen even then but it is understandable. A diver with a rescue card though? No way.

 

[drrich2]

Rescue is indeed in my mind more about having the awareness to prevent accidents before they happen but it is also about being able to respond appropriately when it is needed and a Rescue Diver card says they can.

Or could at the time they got the cert. Wonder how many people retain effective competency in this regard after, say, a couple of years plus.

Richard.

 

[Jim Lapenta]

Good question and why I will be offering a rescue refresher for those that want it. Less cost than the full class, but just as intense if not more so in the water. I am also not above pulling things like going "unconscious", "running out of air", and "panicking" with students I have trained when just diving with them for fun. Keeps em sharp. And I like to think that a diver who is issued a rescue card will be conscientious enough to do something to keep those skills somewhat current. Wishful thinking I know but a Rescue card should be more than just another piece of plastic. And I try to market it as such and impress on them throughout the class that it's a good idea to practice as often as possible. Just let the DM, captain, lifeguard, etc know before you do some of the drills.

 

[cbm32]

Wow this is some thread for sure.

Last fall I dove with a guy that claimed to have just gotten his DM a couple months before and to have logged 200 dives total. His skills sucked big time.

I am not sure that a diver that is unsure of themselves to the point of liking to have a professional in the water with them is anywhere near as dangerous as a guy that thinks he knows it all after collecting a cert or two and so just goes and forges ahead getting himself, and maybe others that foolishly trust him, into stuff they have not right being in.

 

[SeaHorse81]

Last fall I dove with a guy that claimed to have just gotten his DM a couple months before and to have logged 200 dives total. His skills sucked big time.

And there's a big point for OP to consider. If you're going to hire a DM to take care of you and you're okay with needing/wanting to do that, how do you assure that the DM you're getting isn't somebody like the one described above?

I've seen DMs who are brilliant in the water, and I personally miss no opportunity to sing the praises of the various DMs who have made my path through diving much more enjoyable.

I've seen DMs whose practices made me wonder if they actually had a legitimate cert, or whether they maybe just claimed the title and nobody ever checked to see if they had any training. There was a DM on one of my liveaboard trips (as a fellow guest) who went on a night dive. She managed three impressive feats for a single dive: First, she and her buddy got separated from the rest of the group. Then, she and her buddy lost the boat. Then, she and her buddy got separated. At night, lost boat and lost buddy. Ended up being retrieved by the boat crew via dinghy. How bad do you have to be to manage all of that, and yet she was a certified DM. :shocked2:

If you're going to rely on DMs for your safety, I hope you at least vet them very thoroughly, because you never know.

Whatever you do, I hope you stay safe and enjoy your diving.

 

[DevonDiver]

I've seen DMs whose practices made me wonder if they actually had a legitimate cert, or whether they maybe just claimed the title and nobody ever checked to see if they had any training.

It's worth bearing in mind that PADI Divemaster qualification is subject to no external verification - and can be conducted by an OWSI.

Unlike instructor ratings, which are subject to external verification through an independently audited Instructor Examination (IE), there is no process for an independent agency third-party to assess or confirm the quality of training/competence of a divemaster.

This situation opens up a number of potential issues, primarily defined by the instructor training the DM:

1) Quality of training provided to the divemaster is variable.
2) Quality of instructor may be variable - DM training can be done by a newly-qualified, minimally experienced OWSI.
3) Performance standards may not be adhered to for certification.

I've seen more than a few qualified Divemasters who showed signs that they had never met, or been taught, to the performance requirements of the course. In some situations, I have sincere doubts that they were just 'signed off' by a less-than-ethical instructor - either for a cash bribe or because of friendships etc.

All it takes is a few signatures by an instructor - no audit, no verification by the agency.

I've also seen barely competent, newly-qualified and minimally experienced instructors teaching DM courses. I don't see how a newly certified, 100-dive, zero-to-hero instructor can legitimately train effective Divemasters - and frankly, I am stunned that some agencies would permit that situation to exist.

In some instances, a Divemaster training course can simply be a case of the blind leading the blind.

Divemaster courses are big money to dive centers - and the 'Go Pro' and 'Join the Tribe' (DM training) campaigns are VERY actively promoted by PADI to their pro members. A lot of thought goes into who could teach those courses, very little goes into who should teach them.

I feel, in many ways, that PADI and dive centers now view DM training as a niche activity for gap-yearers etc, rather than a legitimate pro-level certification to work in the industry in a responsible, professional role that has a distinct impact on diver safety.

Another issue is that the agency applies no standards to the conduct of fun dives. A training course is subject to meticulous standards - that serve to quality manage the activities of instructors involved. Where such standards are infringed, there is an active quality assurance process to remediate/discipline those instructors in infringe standards. Basically - there are consequences for doing a shoddy job.

That is not true for fun diving activities. There are no defined 'standards' that non-training dives are held against - and no quality assurance process related to that. In a nutshell, a divemaster can act how they want without fear of consequence against their professional status.

Again, I feel that it is major failing not to apply the formal Quality Assurance process to the conduct of Divemasters (and instructors) on non-training dives (where that PADI member/pro is acting in a professional supervisory role).

As it stands, the system relies on the 'get-out' that participating divers are qualified in their own right, and should be following 'Safe Diving Principles' to ensure their own safety. The only 'pressure' on supervising divers is legal responsibility and duty-of-care that may be present from applicable governmental/legal legislation. That might work in some locales, but it isn't much of a motivator in less-developed countries, where fear of litigation/liability is virtually zero.

The best advice for the novice diver is to appreciate that possession of a Divemaster certification alone should not be relied upon as tangible evidence of high-quality training, professionalism or even diving competence on behalf of the holder.

Use your eyes and your common sense to assess the merits of anyone who you consider trusting with your safety in the water.

 

[DaleC]

I have no desire to discuss the OP's abilities but the topic does intrigue me on a broader scale.

I see a few themes that disturb me though I know it is the way of the world and unlikely to change.

The first is the message of "continuous education" that seems to be so prevalent. Yes, I understand the need to seek further education when one bumps up against a circumstance or condition that one is unprepared for and I'm not anti education, but it seems sometimes that diving, and taking courses, are now equated as one and the same. It puzzles me because I wonder when enough is enough. I know, when I started diving, I did so because I wanted to dive - not spend all my time and money taking courses. I felt prepared to do so after AOW and have been so busy diving that I haven't felt the need to go sit in a classroom again. I wonder how many other divers also started off the same way but, like the OP, were given the message that your safety (and image as a "good" diver) depends on taking the next course, and the next, and the next. My experience with diving is very personal: me and the water, and the interaction with what lies below. Sometimes it seems that courses (and DM's) act as a buffer between that experience and the diver or as an artificial template for that interaction to occur within.

The second thing that strikes me is the way diving is promoted today (as compared to the past). At the risk of sounding like an old dinosaur and generalizing I see a difference that leads to situations such as the OP is experiencing. Today, one can take a course in a weekend and the next weekend jet off to a world class destination to do big dives that divers in the past would have had to work towards for a long period of time. In fact, this is somewhat the norm. There is very little emphasis placed on local beginners diving by the "dive industry" and an over abundance of destination diving promotion (where one is always diving unknown locales with strangers). When diving was club oriented (as opposed to industry oriented), there was a more orderly progression from beginner towards experienced diver with mentorship being an important component of the process. Newer divers usually were not allowed or invited on the big dives until they worked there way up to them. Which brings me to my next point.

Thirdly is the ability for the modern diver to buy their way into diving instead of "earn" their way. By this I mean that the modern diver can bypass the need to fit in with others and submit themselves to judgment of behavior and skills, group rules, limitations etc... by simply paying for their experience. This allows divers of lower abilities to "jump the queue" and show up at dives that otherwise would require an accumulation of skills/experience before attempting. Either by hiring a professional to accompany them or by not spending the time working with a group of like minded divers to develop training, interpersonal and logistical skills, the modern diver can easily find themselves at world class dive sites - completely out of their depths.

I know the good old days were not always "that good" and divers of the past could get themselves in just as much trouble, but I think some of these issues do contribute to newer divers, who should be doing local basic open water dives to develop confidence, constantly relating simple situations causing big troubles during exotic dives they aren't really prepared for and really shouldn't be doing.

 

[Doubler]

Dale
You nailed it. We were in Truk in March and a guy on the boat had just finished BOW, zero buoyancy control and a real danger to himself and others but his LDS had a spot to sell and he had cash. JJ and all the guides had to baby sit the guy or he would wind up on his back heading for the bottom and some of the bottoms are deep there.
Everyone is pilling on Matt about his "certification level" and how he should be experienced enough to do the dives he does. Matt to me seems to be a victim of LDS cert pushing. Instead of helping the guy get experience they push continuing education. You see it every place you go, someone that can't assemble their gear correctly is an AOW diver. Think about it, no names here, but there was a "Rescue Diver" that went on his honeymoon....... Matt my advice to you would be stop the education and gain the experience with a DM or more experienced buddy. As far as DM navigation goes, bring them to a new site and have them navigate back to the boat, most can't, just saying.

 

[koyote1111]

Maybe a poll would be an interesting way to address some of these issues? I would love to see a poll asking divers if they felt confident enough, after their OW certification, to dive without supervision.

In all honesty, I would have said NO...and I was a good student, caught on pretty quickly, love adventure, etc. I think that I truly realized this after becoming more experienced and understanding some of the mistakes that I initially made. I probably got lucky and wonder if there are a lot of others who also do.

I think it's the system/agency...sometimes the instructor...and sometimes the dive shop. Obviously the dive industry is for-profit. Becoming more efficient leads to greater profit. Unfortunately, greater efficiency sometimes equates to a lower quality learning experience.

I've been an educator in the discipline of Kinesiology for 26 years now. Scuba is serious business in terms of acquiring skills and understanding concepts to ensure safety. That this is somehow supposed to happen in a couple of classroom and pool sessions, then a few dives...well, it may for some.

My instructor once told me that with Padi, no one fails. During my DM cert, I also learned much more about the latitude that an individual instructor may have in assessing a student's competency. For example, if a student is unable to clear their mask 4 times, then manages to clear it twice...is that a pass??

Honestly...I think that an OW certification should be the equivalent of a semester long class (where I teach, this would mean about 54 hours of classroom/pool/ocean training and actual dive time.

Perhaps in a perfect world...students would be willing to invest the time and agencies would be willing to sacrifice some degree of profit for a more extensive certification process.