mnash760
Registered
I am looking to make the jump into tech diving this year and was wondering if anyone had a recommendation on which agency to start down this track with? Any instructors you could recommend in the southern CA area?
Question Agency Recommendations for AN/DP?
- Thread starter mnash760
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OP
mnash760
Registered
Just saw the thread below on PADI vs. TDI. besides these two, are there any other agencies that warrant consideration? NAUI, SSI, GUE?
It's really about the instructor, the agency isn't really an issue...
OP
mnash760
Registered
What are some key attributes to look for in a tech instructor?
VsubT
Contributor
Check out Six Skills by Steve Lewis. There’s a great section addressing your questions, including how to find and interview tech instructors when you’re getting started. Keep in mind they’ll be interviewing you as a student too.
Lance
OP
mnash760
Registered
Awesome, thanks for the info!
AN/DP is NOT tech here in Europe, being taught in recreational courses from no-profit agencies such as CMAS and BSAC.
Of course with some "reasonable" depth limits and deco duration limits, and no "weird" gas mixtures for accelerated deco.
Beyond this, "real" tech diving begins, with its additional complexities and risks.
My personal position is that, within these "recreational deco" limits, the agency has little relevance, and the instructor is what matters.
I never crossed this rec limit.
But, if I even had thought to step up to real tech diving, then I think it becomes advisable to restrict the section to agencies specialised in tech diving, and to instructors who practice tech diving themselves.
Of course with some "reasonable" depth limits and deco duration limits, and no "weird" gas mixtures for accelerated deco.
Beyond this, "real" tech diving begins, with its additional complexities and risks.
My personal position is that, within these "recreational deco" limits, the agency has little relevance, and the instructor is what matters.
I never crossed this rec limit.
But, if I even had thought to step up to real tech diving, then I think it becomes advisable to restrict the section to agencies specialised in tech diving, and to instructors who practice tech diving themselves.
If you want to find out if GUE is something for you, try a GUE Fundamentals class. Best case you find what you're looking for. Worst case you learn a lot, become a better diver and are better prepared for any tech classes you might take in the future, as the core skills of buoyancy, situational awareness etc. are quite important whichever route you go down. The bonus is that with GUE, you can be pretty sure you're getting good instruction regardless of who you take it with as they have possibly the highest bar for quality control of instructors. This is especially helpful because it's hard to know how to find a good tech instructor if you don't know what you're looking for.
DiveLikeAMuppet
Contributor
Find the right instructor - a good way to find an instructor is to go diving, look for divers who are sorted out on the surface and underwater, and ask about their training paths.
The instructor should have a pragmatic approach to teaching - enough to get you diving safely. They will usually offer the course at a day rate with an expected but not guaranteed number of days to complete + certification on top that you have to earn. Avoid instructors who would teach the class to just one person, it's always more "fun" (more failures and bigger mess) if you have a team of 2-3 trainees.
Ask if they recently failed a student and why. Ask if they have an informal club for recent students to go training together, organize trips etc. - it's really important to have a group of people who are at a similar level to progress your diving as it will take you some time to dive the same dives you did during your training. Maybe the instructor has some diving planned in a local quarry and you could tag along?
Check if the instructor is not too burned out - sometimes it's better (especially at the beginner AN/DP level) to train with someone who hasn't taught hundreds of courses. Your training might be a bit rough on the edges but they will care, as opposed to a superstar instructor who might only want to teach 100+ meter diving but has to run yet another AN/DP course to pay the bills.
You could also just ask for a day of scuba coaching to experience their approach - personality matters too.
TDI, IANTD and PADI are big in Europe, with GUE, SSI and RAID capturing the niche markets. There is also club diving within BSAC/CMAS.
The market is down at least in Europe so many of the instructors might not have any classes pre-planned - but will be able to setup one for you.
GUE is great for Fundies and cave but the deeper diving path is problematic - T1 (and should you decide to, CCR1) route is really expensive with current helium prices and you might struggle with finding teammates. If you have the option, pick a GUE-trained instructor and do a TDI AN/DP or equivalent IANTD class with them.
Oh and don't overthink it, it's just basic deco course anyway
.
The instructor should have a pragmatic approach to teaching - enough to get you diving safely. They will usually offer the course at a day rate with an expected but not guaranteed number of days to complete + certification on top that you have to earn. Avoid instructors who would teach the class to just one person, it's always more "fun" (more failures and bigger mess) if you have a team of 2-3 trainees.
Ask if they recently failed a student and why. Ask if they have an informal club for recent students to go training together, organize trips etc. - it's really important to have a group of people who are at a similar level to progress your diving as it will take you some time to dive the same dives you did during your training. Maybe the instructor has some diving planned in a local quarry and you could tag along?
Check if the instructor is not too burned out - sometimes it's better (especially at the beginner AN/DP level) to train with someone who hasn't taught hundreds of courses. Your training might be a bit rough on the edges but they will care, as opposed to a superstar instructor who might only want to teach 100+ meter diving but has to run yet another AN/DP course to pay the bills.
You could also just ask for a day of scuba coaching to experience their approach - personality matters too.
TDI, IANTD and PADI are big in Europe, with GUE, SSI and RAID capturing the niche markets. There is also club diving within BSAC/CMAS.
The market is down at least in Europe so many of the instructors might not have any classes pre-planned - but will be able to setup one for you.
GUE is great for Fundies and cave but the deeper diving path is problematic - T1 (and should you decide to, CCR1) route is really expensive with current helium prices and you might struggle with finding teammates. If you have the option, pick a GUE-trained instructor and do a TDI AN/DP or equivalent IANTD class with them.
Oh and don't overthink it, it's just basic deco course anyway
.
I have a list of 32 questions in my second book, "SCUBA: A Practical Guide to Advanced Level Diving" that while geared towards new and AOW divers can be applied to AN/DP training as well. The agency doesn't matter usually UNLESS the instructor is only teaching to the agency minimums. Then it becomes a problem IMO because the minimums in tech diving leave a lot out of the training.
Technical agencies generally allow the instructor a great deal of freedom to add to the material based on their experience, training conditions, and student levels of experience and training.
Most expect the instructor to go above and beyond the material they offer. Good instructors create their own supplemental material, have strict minimum entry requirements, and have good reasons for them. They also have strict exit requirements for certification and will not issue a card even if you meet the agency standards for skills and knowledge. They want more out of the people who are reflecting their knowledge and experience.
They may charge more as well. But you get what you pay for.
Some examples of the questions to ask are below and adapted from the ones in my book.
How often do you do advanced or technical level dives outside of classes?
How many students do you take on advanced-level or technical level dives?
Do you allow different equipment configurations to be used?
Are you adding to the class or just teaching to the minimum agency standards and why?
What is the maximum depth you will be taking us to on the deeper dives and what actual dive skills will we be asked to do?
Is every dive going to introduce new skills? They certainly should!
Is certification as an advanced level or technical diver guaranteed after this class? The answer you want to hear is “Absolutely not!”
If I feel I need more time or practice will you allow that and make time for it?
Technical agencies generally allow the instructor a great deal of freedom to add to the material based on their experience, training conditions, and student levels of experience and training.
Most expect the instructor to go above and beyond the material they offer. Good instructors create their own supplemental material, have strict minimum entry requirements, and have good reasons for them. They also have strict exit requirements for certification and will not issue a card even if you meet the agency standards for skills and knowledge. They want more out of the people who are reflecting their knowledge and experience.
They may charge more as well. But you get what you pay for.
Some examples of the questions to ask are below and adapted from the ones in my book.
How often do you do advanced or technical level dives outside of classes?
How many students do you take on advanced-level or technical level dives?
Do you allow different equipment configurations to be used?
Are you adding to the class or just teaching to the minimum agency standards and why?
What is the maximum depth you will be taking us to on the deeper dives and what actual dive skills will we be asked to do?
Is every dive going to introduce new skills? They certainly should!
Is certification as an advanced level or technical diver guaranteed after this class? The answer you want to hear is “Absolutely not!”
If I feel I need more time or practice will you allow that and make time for it?
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