Appropriate to ask for a refund? Trip report from my first salt water dive!

[RJP]

They did refund the $20 for the DM.

Then you're all good.

If you were the one who had a cramp... would you ask for a refund?
If the DM simply burned through his tank faster than you did... would you ask for a refund?
If the DM had been bitten by a shark, or had a heart attack... would you ask for a refund?

One of the cardinal rules of diving is "Anyone can call any dive, any time, for any reason... with no recriminations."

 

[DENLASCUBA]

If the diver is the reason the dive ended early that is a different story and no refund should be issued. If it is due to the DM why should the diver have to pay for something he only partially received which would also mean the DM will not receive pay as he could not complete his assignment.

I have have had a few instances where I was asked by another company to take on their student or fun diver as the instructor/guide was not able to finish that day on the boat due to various reasons.

The instructor/ guide did not get paid, and the customer was given some form of compensation from the original operator as they hired a private instructor/ guide and now had to join a group instead of one on one.

 

[Colliam7]

So general consensus; Should I be entitled to a partial refund since the first dive was cut short by the DM?

No. It was unfortunate, but it happened- the DM had a cramp. You had a 'shorter than planned for dive'.

It wasn't so much that the first dive was cut short, but that was part of it. It just seemed like the crew had a laissez-faire attitude toward my request. Maybe I had my expectations too high, hence the reason for the post.

I can appreciate your concern. But, yes, your expectations were, if not too 'high', a bit misaligned with the general reality of boat diving. There was apparently little / poor communication among the crew - the DM you had been told you were going to dive with on the 2nd dive probably was not aware of that 'assignment' when he hopped in for a personal dive during the customers' surface interval. Some boat operations are better than others, this one seems - from one side of the story - a bit lax. That is not unheard of, and the maturity and professionalism of boat DMs does vary quite a bit across the various charter boats operating off the NC coast - some are excellent, while some are relatively young, immature people holding a DM card and working boats to get some dives in.

You learned 2 valuable lessons: a) find another charter operator (or specific boat, depending on which operator you went out with) the next time you dive in that area, and b) diving with a DM may not be worth the extra money. Ultimately, you want to be able to dive with a buddy, and without 'assistance'.

 

[RJP]

I particularly liked the DM taking his option to blow off any service obligations in favor of his own pleasure.

Let's be fair in one respect... it's quite likely the second DM had no idea that the first DM committed him to diving with the OP. Yes, it was incumbent upon DM1 to communicate that fact to DM2, but as someone else mentioned above, it would have been advisable for the OP to confirm the change in plans with the second DM.

I would bet that if you did an analysis of all stories posted on SB about problems people have had with dive boat operators - DM didn't give a tour, boat went to different wreck than advertised, they wanted to see my nitrox card, insta-buddy didn't follow my plan, captain didn't allow solo-diving, whatever - that 99% of those problems would have been completely obviated by better communication between the two parties.

Yes, in the perfect world we'd have great, service-oriented boat and LDS operators with phenomenal business acumen, doing a fantastic job of anticipating - and meeting - their customers wants, needs, and desires. In such a utopian dive industry, it would not be incumbent upon the customer to be in charge of the necessary communication to ensure their wants, needs, and desires are understood.

I find the Venn Diagram below to be a useful reference when you're discussing any specific group of people and why they behave and act the way that they do:

The reality is that the dive industry is not comprised of "business people" but rather it is largely comprised of people whose sole qualification is that they are dumb enough to try to make a living doing what they - and we - love to do.

God bless these people - because we'd all be on one big extended surface interval if not for them - but divers need to understand and accept this reality. Doing so means that divers need to take on greater responsibility for the outcome of their interactions with people in the dive industry.

Best regards,

Ray Purkis

 

[DivemasterDennis]

richiewrt, I think the issue is this: if you are a certified diver, you should know that you dive with a buddy, whether a dm or another person on the boat. Either buddy can thumb the dive due to cramp, illness, equipment, injury, air depletion. That is just diving. SO as to dive 1, that is what happens. As to dive 2,k they did not charge you for the dm, so that is fair. As a diver you need to be attentive to and stay with your buddy(s). The problem on that dive was yours, not the dive operator's. I hope you learned from the experience. I am sure you are a better diver now then before these dives. Stay at it.
DivemasterDennis

 

[drbill]

Personally I would expect the operator to refund the charge for both DMs. A DM is a dive professional and although a cramp is not necessarily the first DM's fault, it did cut short your dive. As far as I'm concerned 1,000 psi is a lot of air (your mileage may differ). However, I wouldn't expect a refund for either dive itself.

 

[beaverdivers]

Well, on the first dive of a two tank dive, we end up back on the boat @ about 25 minutes with me having >1500 psi in my tank because the DM had a cramp. I understand that things happen, but this was an easy dive in very mild current.

So general consensus; Should I be entitled to a partial refund since the first dive was cut short by the DM?

Yes, I believe that you are entitled a credit. If it were up to me, I would offer you a full credit for a future dive. This credit is a Win - Win. I have an chance to redeem myself & you get another dive.

I feel that it is vital to create customers for life.

Do you feel that is fair?

 

[Wookie]

Yes, I believe that you are entitled a credit. If it were up to me, I would offer you a full credit for a future dive. This credit is a Win - Win. I have an chance to redeem myself & you get another dive.

I feel that it is vital to create customers for life.

Do you feel that is fair?

He didn't ask for a CREDIT, he asked for a refund. You've just changed the whole dynamic. Would you give him a refund on a regulator he bought, used, shows signs of use, and breaths hard? Many would offer a free adjustment, but would you refund him?

 

[Lorenzoid]

As divers going out together on a boat, even those of us who are paying customers assume some of the risk that one or more dives will be cut short or otherwise not live up to our expectations due to any of a number of unpredictable factors, including your fellow divers. You paid a separate fee for a DM to accompany you, and because the DM was unable to do that you received a refund for that fee. That is all you were entitled to. (Whether the dive operator chooses voluntarily to give you more than you are entitled to, as a gesture of goodwill, is up to them.)

As someone else said, welcome to the pastime of scuba diving. If you do more diving of this type, you can expect to blow lots more money that you feel for one reason or another didn't produce the results you thought it would. That said, the first time you pay for a dive trip that DOES come off perfectly and leaves you grinning from ear to ear, you will forget all about the ones that didn't.

 

[FinnMom]

It was nice that you got your DM fee back & not neccesarily something that would have happened anywhere. Many guys would figure that they showed up and gave it their best shot so they have a right to their money, and there's logic in that too. Kind of like when I've paid a mechanic for hours for labor during which he didn't manage to fix my car. Any more of a refund just isn't the way it goes. The captain & crew all did their best and deserve their normal compensation, and costs are in no way decreased by someone having a short dive, or no dive.

Sorry it was a little dissappointing for you but you gotta learn to say that's the way it goes sometimes & let it go. Picture it as another credit to your karma bank. As others said, this is because it needs to be OK for anyone to call a dive at any time for any reason - a worn recording I know but it's important and it's ***REALLY*** nice when it's your "fault" and everyone is OK with it (karma bank withdrawl if you will).

Try to get out & dive a lot, even the little local spots with nothing but rocks & light & water to admire. The more you dive the easier you will find it to miss out on a dive and take it in stride.

Another thing you can do is pay attention to gear maintenace, make & use a good written checklist for packing your gear and take proper care of yourself before a dive (fluids yes, alcohol little to none) => => over time this will gain you dives in all the ones you didn't miss out on because you failed to... (see above).