heard bad news while diving today

[H2Andy]

an assault is generally defined as "the threat or attempt to strike another, whether successful or not, provided the target is aware of the danger"

upon touching the body of the target, an assault becomes a battery, "the willful or intentional touching of a person against that person’s will by another person."

they will often be coupled as a single crime "assault and battery," even though they are two separate crimes.

by the letter of the law, pushing someone off a boat and into the water constitutes assault (if the victim saw it coming) and battery (if it's against the victim's consent)

whether an officer on the scene will actually make an arrest ... well... that will depend a lot on the circumstances, who the people invovolved were, what was their relationship, what was their behaviour prior to the incident (were they joking around or were things tense?), etc.

Words alone, no matter how insulting or provocative, do not justify an assault or battery against the person who utters the words.

 

[ClevelandDiver]

an assault is generally defined as "the threat or attempt to strike another, whether successful or not, provided the target is aware of the danger"

upon touching the body of the target, an assault becomes a battery, "the willful or intentional touching of a person against that person’s will by another person."

they will often be coupled as a single crime "assault and battery," even though they are two separate crimes.

by the letter of the law, pushing someone off a boat and into the water constitutes assault (if the victim saw it coming) and battery (if it's against the victim's consent)

whether an officer on the scene will actually make an arrest ... well... that will depend a lot on the circumstances, who the people invovolved were, what was their relationship, what was their behaviour prior to the incident (were they joking around or were things tense?), etc.

Words alone, no matter how insulting or provocative, do not justify an assault or battery against the person who utters the words.

Thanks Andy,

I threw that one out there with express intention of getting your educated response, I knew you couldn't pass it up!

Mike

 

[H2Andy]

oh man, am i easy

 

[Walter]

It is the act of grabbing and hurling/pushing someone into the water against their will that will get you in trouble.

If that were the case, I would have spent most of my college years in jail. Assault is in the mind of the victim. It was much easier to assault Don Knotts than John Wayne. If you hit someone, you have committed both assault and battery. Shaking a fist in their face may or may not be assault, it all depends on if they felt threatened. Gently picking someone up and dropping them in the water is an assault if they felt threatened. If you do it to a non-swimmer, there's an excellent case for assault. If you do it to a dive instructor, you'll have a much harder time convincing the jury she was frightened by being dropped into the water.

 

[H2Andy]

ok, to parse assault out even more, the three prongs are:

1. An intentional, unlawful threat or "offer" to cause bodily injury to another by force;

2.Under circumstances which create in the other person a well-founded fear of imminent peril;

3.Where there exists the apparent present ability to carry out the act if not prevented.

so you need to think about what "bodily injury" and "fear of imminent peril" mean... up to a point. "bodily injury" can mean a simple touching. "fear of imminent peril" can mean not wanting to be touched.

[edit: i don't think my statement that there can't be a battery without an assault is accurate. i'll stay out of that one since i'm not a criminal lawyer)

 

[mrjimboalaska]

Hey, I just have to hire Andy when I assault the person who throw's any of my gear overboard.....act like an *****, you are going to be treated like an *****.
In regards to this post, it sounds as though the diver was doing the acting, like I mentioned, I do DO surface intervals, have'nt the faintist idea why.......
But, I don't care, toss my gear overboard intentionally, I will intentionally toss you so you can retreave it. Let's call it...."Assisted De-barkation" (damn spelling)

 

[ClevelandDiver]

If that were the case, I would have spent most of my college years in jail. Assault is in the mind of the victim. It was much easier to assault Don Knotts than John Wayne. If you hit someone, you have committed both assault and battery. Shaking a fist in their face may or may not be assault, it all depends on if they felt threatened. Gently picking someone up and dropping them in the water is an assault if they felt threatened. If you do it to a non-swimmer, there's an excellent case for assault. If you do it to a dive instructor, you'll have a much harder time convincing the jury she was frightened by being dropped into the water.

In the context given, man retaliates for his masking being tossed overboard, I am pretty sure it would not have been a friendly gentle assist into the water.

 

[ClevelandDiver]

Hey, I just have to hire Andy when I assault the person who throw's any of my gear overboard.....act like an *****, you are going to be treated like an *****.
In regards to this post, it sounds as though the diver was doing the acting, like I mentioned, I do DO surface intervals, have'nt the faintist idea why.......
But, I don't care, toss my gear overboard intentionally, I will intentionally toss you so you can retreave it. Let's call it...."Assisted De-barkation" (damn spelling)

Person throws mask overboard, you throw person overboard, person cracks head on boat and is seriously injured or dies, your kids visit you in jail over a $40 mask that you could have made the person retrieve or repurchase once you returned to shore.

Andy, what is the going rate for a criminal defense lawyer that works for mere mortals (not the rich and famous)?

 

[Walter]

ok, to parse assault out even more, the three prongs are:

1. An intentional, unlawful threat or "offer" to cause bodily injury to another by force;

2.Under circumstances which create in the other person a well-founded fear of imminent peril;

3.Where there exists the apparent present ability to carry out the act if not prevented.


so you need to think about what "bodily injury" and "fear of imminent peril" mean... up to a point

if there is a battery (the unconsented touching of the person) there is an assault. you can't have a battery without an assault.

thus, don't concentrate on the assault in this analysis, since there is a battery present. "bodily injury" can mean a simple touching. "fear of imminent peril" can mean not wanting to be touched.

Hard to imagine touching can constitue battery, but assuming that is the case, in addition to the theft, we already have a battery when the mask was taken from the diver.

Does battery include touching items the person is wearing?

 

[H2Andy]

yes, simply touching someone can constitute a battery (for example, touch a stranger in the neck at a movie theater; they can easily charge you with battery)


not sure what your scenario is, but grabbing a diver's mask (without touching the diver) and throwing the mask overboard could be larceny (theft) but it's certainly not battery (it could be classified as criminal mischief -- the intentional destruction of someone else's property, in this case, by making it irretrivable)

and if an officer responds and someone is saying "he threw my mask overboard" and the other person is saying "he grabbed me and threw me overboard"

guess who's going to get their attention?