If you are a new diver, please read this

[Peter Guy]

I find it really disturbing that your husband was told he could not teach gas management at the OW level. But I bet he'll find a way to do it anyway

Husband writing -- I am NOT into Agency Bashing -- in no small part because I've been trained by 5 (?) different agencies (maybe 6 or 7 depending on how you count A.G.!).

During my IDC (Instructor Development Course) I have heard many good things said which would indicate that this particular Instructor REALLY is trying to raise the bar and encourage a significantly higher standard of training within his (my) agency. Good Stuff!

It is true that I was told NOT to teach "Gas Management" at the Open Water Level --- and I described the conversation in another thread (in the Instructor Forum, a closed forum). What Lynne (my wife) left OUT of her statement was that I was encouraged to teach, hell, TOLD to teach OW students how depth affects (increases) gas usage. In fact, it is both graphically and verbally described in the text that your "available gas" decreases (dramatically) with depth. (Here I'm using "available gas" as a shorthand to say that you are breathing "X" times as many molecules at "Y" depth as you are on the surface -- thus shortening the amount of time you may spend at "Y" depth.)

As far as I can tell, what I'm NOT supposed to say is that this is "Gas Management" nor am I supposed to say "You, as a new diver, will probably breathe about 1 ft3/minute at the surface and thus will have 72 minutes of air with this tank at the surface but only 36 minutes of air at 33 feet." But I can say, "IF it took you 72 minutes to breathe this tank at the surface, it would take you 36 minutes at 33 feet -- BUT we really don't know HOW long it will take so PAY STRICT ATTENTION to your computer/SPG!" This, is NOT, gas management -- but I think I can live with something pretty close to it!

And no one has said anything about NOT providing some "Rules of Thumb" such as "Don't Dive Below the Size of Your Tank!"

For those of you who don't know, Lynne is pretty raw on this whole subject at the moment and this death has hit her pretty hard.

 

[Thalassamania]

Senseless death hits physicans rather harder (I know I have a few in my family) than it does lawyers (I know, I have a few in the family). Give Lynne a big, long hug if you haven't already, in fact if you already have ... do it again.

 

[Jim Ernst]

Book Mark.

 

[don Francisco]

Whenever there's a senseless fatality or serious injury, there's a tendancy to say it could have been prevented "if only....."

This is the same whether it's a plane crash, a head injury on a ski slope, or a drowning on a dive.

We all make the asumption that something could have been done to prevent the accident, or that something can and should be done to prevent the same from happening in the future. At a subconcious level we all want to go back and close the barn door before the horses run off.

I don't know the details of this accident, but don't feel that additional training would have made a difference. An OW student's training limits his depth to 60 feet, and I assume that whatever one calls it, OW students are at least taught the importance of monitoring their air supply.

We can analyze this forever and ponder whether additional or better training might have made a difference, but we also have to accept that no matter how much is done, we cannot undo this tragedy or prevent similar ones in the future.

No matter how much we do we cannot do everything, and we will always have to make decisions about what is good enough. And wherever we draw that line, there will always be situations where we will have not done enough.

 

[Thalassamania]

... No matter how much we do we cannot do everything, and we will always have to make decisions about what is good enough. And wherever we draw that line, there will always be situations where we will have not done enough.

I disagree wholeheartedly with your conclusion and so do the facts. There is, demonstrably, a level of entry-level training that appears to have been 100 percent effective in preventing these sorts of incidents for over half a century.

 

[don Francisco]

I disagree wholeheartedly with your conclusion and so do the facts. There is, demonstrably, a level of entry-level training that appears to have been 100 percent effective in preventing these sorts of incidents for over half a century.

I think you missed my point. But in any case, 100% effectiveness is a pretty strong claim.

 

[Gen San Chris]

I am a bit confused as to a lot of comments on this thread as there are a few things which were not mentioned, ie: How deep had they dived, was it deeper than 60 ft, the recomended max for open water divers? How long were thay down for? How much air had the buddy got left and was he OK!
Everyone seems to be pointing fingers at the training institutions saying that the have been told not to teach gas management on OW courses!
I am a PADI Instructor and am not afraid to say so and during OW training, in module 1 of the manual and on the DVD there is the section on Effects of Increased Air Density! this explains quite simply in words and graphics that the shallower you dive then you use less air and the deeper you dive you use more air!
To me, that IS teaching basic air management and it seems to work for most divers!
It is very sad when any diver has a fatal accident but without knowing the full facts of the incident then I am afraid that one can only speculate and point fingers which in most cases is not the best thing to do!

 

[DennisW]

Gas management can be taught in the basic OW and it used to be taught in the YMCA OW course. Now that SEI is the agency, I'll bet it is still taught in their basic OW course. Many people have disparaged the Y instructors for over teaching, but I personally would rather know more than I have to know, than just enough to let me breath compressed air. "Just Enough" can very quickly become "Not Nearly Enough" in an emergency situation. Having more knowledge can keep a sticky situation from becoming an emergency in the first place. I was taught gas management in my OW class. Everyone should have what I consider is basic knowledge in their tool kit.

 

[ktownhero]

Seems like everybody is very quick to jump to conclusions in this thread. Wouldn't it make more sense to know what actually happened before assuming it had to do with poor instruction? There could be any number of variables that would dramatically change the story.

 

[Peter Guy]

Gen San Chris -- As I wrote above, I agree with you regarding teaching some basic Gas Management under within the PADI system. One caveat I might make is that doing this ONLY in Class Session One is not enough. This is important enough, I believe, that it should be integrated into any discussion of "dive planning" whether that is when teaching the Tables, how to pick a dive site, or whatever.

I don't know the stats (and if someone does, PLEASE join in) but it seems to me that DCS (and here I'm referring to Type 1/Type 2 hits) is, in fact, of pretty limited relevance to the new OW diver. OTOH, running low or out of air to the new OW diver is a BIG issue and I believe that given the choice, I'd spend a whole lot more time on "gas management" and a lot less time on learning the Tables. But that is JUST me -- a guppy in training.