Koh Tao instructor for kids

[Bowmouth]

Not sure in this situation but my experience of Koh Tao would suggest, the boat was going to two dive sites and the first being Chumpon Pinnacle which was unsuitable for their needs but most suitable for others.

Twins, White Rock, or Jap Gardens are the usual sites after a dive at Chumpon.

I hope you're right!
Taking kids (or any OWD students) to do training dives at Chumpon Pinnacle wouldn't be right.

 

[bjexpat]

MarineDiva is correct - it was the first of two sites that day. We did Japanese Gardens immediately afterwards.

I'm interested to know why Chumphon would be bad for *any* OWD student. I did my OWD a similar place with similar surface conditions in Koh Chang (and not as pretty). I can understand the 10 year-olds not doing it but it was the final certification dive for 12 and 14-year olds who did great there. Is it just the depth?

 

[marinediva]

Bj
It would be the depth as the top of the pinnacle is from memory 18/20m.
Also the conditions can also be very unfriendly for new divers, with current and chop.

I could understand a final dive but only on a good morning, rarely on an afternoon.

South west Pinnacle would be far more suitable.

Are the Whale sharks there yet?

 

[Bowmouth]

MarineDiva is correct - it was the first of two sites that day. We did Japanese Gardens immediately afterwards.

I'm interested to know why Chumphon would be bad for *any* OWD student. I did my OWD a similar place with similar surface conditions in Koh Chang (and not as pretty). I can understand the 10 year-olds not doing it but it was the final certification dive for 12 and 14-year olds who did great there. Is it just the depth?

Before you start reading you should know that i am an "old school" Master Instructor and have my own "stubborn, hard to kill" set of rules when I teach Student Divers.

In my opinion should all Open Water Student Divers do all their Open Water Training dives at sites that are preferably offering calm and sheltered waters, have an entry/decent area with a sandy bottom not exceeding 10-12 meters (33-40 fsw) and that are within short distance from shore or boat.

Chumpon Pinnacles and other more "Advanced" sites where environmental conditions can (and often will) rapidly change during the course of one single dive and which may have a bottom exceeding 18 meters (60 fsw) should for student's safety not be chosen as Open Water Training Dive site.
Often Instructors will give their Open Water Student Diver the feeling they do them a favor by taking them to such a nice dive site and Open Water Student Divers feel thrilled and excited that their Instructor takes them to such sites. Reality though is that even the best Open Water Student Diver still is just that; an Open Water Student Diver.

I strongly believe student divers are much and much better of taken to suitable sites where they will have a proper chance to practice the Open Water Diver course skills with their Instructor and other student divers in a safe and comfortable environment. Ultimately at the end of the course they will be better prepared for unsupervised recreational diving than other student divers who may have seen more fishies during their course but learned a lot less or found themselves in trouble during their training dives.

Then again, I am old school....

 

[bjexpat]

Bowmouth,
Thanks for the reply and don't apologize for being old-school. I think it's probably a tough balancing act for instructors to help new divers practice their skills and at the same time inspire them to fall in love with the underwater world and learn to relax etc. For example, during my AOW, I was sort of longing for a relaxing dive despite the fact that the extra practice was exactly what I needed.

I'm sure there are threads here which (heatedly) go back and forth regarding certs, experience, teaching philosophy and the interplay between them. I just know that despite recently getting an AOW & EANx cert, I still don't have enough confidence to dive without a divemaster for the foreseeable future. I do feel like I have a good idea how to practice though.

 

[bjexpat]

Bj
It would be the depth as the top of the pinnacle is from memory 18/20m.

I did my 30M deep dive there on (what I think is the) west side of the pinnacle. The kids seemed to stay on a different side side but I *do* think they actually logged something close to 18M.

Are the Whale sharks there yet?

Unfortunately no. I'm dying to go back and see them but will do it sans kids. I heard there were sightings around Sail Rock earlier in the week.

 

[Bowmouth]

I just know that despite recently getting an AOW & EANx cert, I still don't have enough confidence to dive without a divemaster for the foreseeable future. I do feel like I have a good idea how to practice though.

Gradually build up experience and practice your dive skills by diving as often as you can. Proper weighting, buoyancy control, underwater swimming and streamlining and mask clearing are skills you should try to master as soon as possible because they are crucial to enjoyable and safe diving. I still often see certified and "experienced" divers over-weighting themselves, unable to stay neutrally buoyant throughout their dive, unable to hover during their safety stop or while watching marine life and (unfortunately) trashing the reef...

I wish you good luck and lots of enjoyable and safe dives.

 

[Arizona]

The kids seemed to stay on a different side side but I *do* think they actually logged something close to 18M.

How old were the kids in the class and how many? 18m may be too deep!!!! It is a difficult balancing act as you have previously written but standards need to be followed, especially depth and ratios with younger divers. Under 15 has very strict depth standards and the under 12 group has a very small instructor to student ratio. These continue after OW cert until age restrictions change. Look at the cert card for depth restriction. Working with younger students on a regular basis for most of my career really makes me believe these standards should be strictly followed at all times. IMO these are developmentally appropriate and under the instructor's discretion made more conservative if appropriate.

When diving don't be complacent of just following the leader as most do. Practice your nav skills and ask the dive leader how he/she will navigate. By doing this you will greatly improve your skills and confidence.

Its been too long since we last got together. I really hope you come out diving and check out the wrecks in Pattaya with me before we leave for summer holiday. If your in Florida late June/July we can also wreck dive

 

[bjexpat]

There were never more than 2 students per instructor at any time. The the 2 older kids did 18M with an instructor and no other students (just a lurking videographer and the kids dad who is an experienced old NAUI guy...not sure if they would be any help if a problem occurred). On the under-12's first open water dives were 1:1 and never stepped off the boat at areas deeper than 12M.

I'm probably not qualified to assess the instructors but the kids seemed very comfortable, confident and mature on their dives. The instructors commented that their previous confined dive skills were under-reported and they were doing better in their open water dives than many adults at the same stage (and seconded by other instructors who we weren't paying ;-)).

I actually think they benefitted by doing their first confined dives at the chaotic Blue Zoo in Beijing where they had to deal with distracting sharks (my avatar), moray eels, and bikini-clad Chinese mermaids, all while watching tourists snapping photos of them.

 

[Arizona]

There were never more than 2 students per instructor at any time. The the 2 older kids did 18M with an instructor and no other students (just a lurking videographer and the kids dad who is an experienced old NAUI guy...not sure if they would be any help if a problem occurred). On the under-12's first open water dives were 1:1 and never stepped off the boat at areas deeper than 12M.

I'm probably not qualified to assess the instructors but the kids seemed very comfortable, confident and mature on their dives. The instructors commented that their previous confined dive skills were under-reported and they were doing better in their open water dives than many adults at the same stage (and seconded by other instructors who we weren't paying ;-)).

I actually think they benefitted by doing their first confined dives at the chaotic Blue Zoo in Beijing where they had to deal with distracting sharks (my avatar), moray eels, and bikini-clad Chinese mermaids, all while watching tourists snapping photos of them.

Sounds good! What about doing some wrecks.... Glad to see you went ahead with the Blue Zoo Aquarium. That was quite a while ago, but I enjoyed it as well.