No more spearfishing in south Florida?

[CuzzA]

Personally in my view a good move by Florida authorities to ban spearing on SCUBA.

Whilst spear fishing is touted as the most environmentally friendly form of fishing but it does have the potential to serially deplete reef species, particularly those species that have limited ranges or attracted to particular structures or have other elements of their life history that makes them particularly vulnerable. Divers return to those spots taking those fish time and time again significantly depleting that particular population which may never recover. Not so relevant to wide ranging pelagic species.

Where as other forms of recreational fishing are more reliant on an element of luck.

No Florida Authorities have brought forth this ban. This is a group, not the government. I'm confident the Florida Fish and Wildlife Commission would argue they are doing their job just fine.

Do some research on countries that have banned spearfishing on scuba. What you will find is the shallow reefs are decimated as the only means to harvest is limited to areas where a breath hold is possible. Meanwhile the USA has some of the best fisheries in the world. Why? Because we have some of the best sustainability practices and ENFORCEMENT in the world. Is there room for improvement? Of course. But to ban a method of harvest will only increase the use of a different method of harvest. One that may do a lot more damage as pointed out above.

When I see stories like this I think to myself, "these extremist groups are either stupid or don't have a clue what they are talking about. Maybe both."

For example, they're basically arguing BOATS, FISHING AND DIVING need to be banned to save the reef. Meanwhile, the sensible person would ask the question, what aspects of these activities damage the reef? Well it's predominately anchors. So let's ban anchoring on reefs. Another aspect would be divers with terrible buoyancy control. So let's start an initiative on diver education, better training and get a commitment from agency, dive ops, and the FWC to promote better diving practices. Reef briefings before every dive would be a good thing. I can make a correlation to seat belts. I remember growing up seat belts were optional, but now with good education, marketing, etc. just about everyone wears seat belts and it isn't because you can get a ticket. It's because we all know what happens to your head when it goes through the windshield. I believe if divers really knew what they just did when they kicked that coral, they would make sure to never do that again.

Finally, the reefs themselves. They are not in bad shape because of divers, boats and fisherman, they are in bad shape because of pollution, waste management plants, agriculture, shipping lanes and ports right smack next to the reefs. Even CO2 admissions aren't as much of a threat to the reefs as pollution is. I know a thing or two about corals and reef eco systems. I grow them. Corals can easily withstand acidic water. Hell they do just fine even at a pH of 7.8, much lower than the average ocean pH of ~8.2. They do just fine with extreme temperature shifts and long periods of high temperatures. What they can't handle is if I dumped a can of motor oil in my system. My point is this, if we (including these groups) really want to save the reefs, the initiative has to be a phase out of the aforementioned reef killers next to reefs and move them to areas where there is no reef.

Do you know why the SPS corals in South Florida died so rapidly several years ago? It was from a strand of bacteria found in human waste. As we dumped our **** on to the reef it killed the corals. The Army Core of Engineers age old saying about the ocean, "The solution to pollution is dilution." is wrong. The solution to pollution is don't do it.

SO QUIT TARGETING CITIZENS WHO WANT TO HARVEST FISH TO FEED THEIR FAMILIES IN A SUSTAINABLE WAY, WHO ALSO LIKELY DON'T SUPPORT THE TERRIBLE PRACTICE OF LONG LINES, FISHING NETS AND OTHER TERRIBLE FISHING PRACTICES JUST SO PEOPLE CAN BUY SUSHI AT THE RESTAURANT AND SHOW OFF THEIR STATUS WITH SOCIAL MEDIA PICTURES, AND INSTEAD TACKLE THE REAL PROBLEMS THAT ARE EFFECTING OUR REEFS! - Bold and capitalized to emphasize the point.

 

[DA Aquamaster]

I agree it's not as simple as comparing commercial fishing of pelagic fish in open water to spearfishing on reefs and wrecks.

I also agree that an outright ban on spearfishing on scuba is not the answer and instead is more of a knee jerk over reaction.

There are problems with spearfishing on scuba that should be addressed however. It should be banned for certain species and it should be banned or more strictly limited in certain areas depending on the management needs of the species and/or area.

Spearfishing is a much more selective means of harvesting fish, however that's both a blessing and a curse. Managed properly the selective nature of spearfishing can be used to prevent the taking of certain species or age/size classes of fish. However when that's not done it allows the spear fisher to very effectively target areas, species or individual fish in a population that can have a sever negative impact on sustainability.

The challenge is to find the balance and put in place the right mechanisms needed to use spearfishing as an effective management tool. That can be difficult because as soon as you put in place a limit, someone is affected an they'll whine about it, because way too many people seem to put their personal interests and biases ahead of everything else, to the point of letting it drive the information they'll accept and to the point of refusing to think critically or act rationally.

In that regard, proposing a total ban is one way to get the discussion going and ultimately make the imposition of a few essential limits much more palatable.

Using the "ban boats and diving on reefs" analogy, that's a hot button topic that will get the people creating the problem to submit reasonable alternatives. However, if the regulating agency just came forward with prohibitions against anchoring, or minimum diver training requirements to dive on those reefs, those same people would be complaining and resisting the same measures they themselves will offer up in the face of a ban.

 

[CuzzA]

There are two threads going on about this subject and Dumpster posted a very important point in the other thread that should be shared here.

They want to BAN ALL DIVING in the most productive areas.. That is what I read in that proposal. Do we support that? You can't even LOOK at the reef?

"Protect habitat by ELIMINATING damage from boating, fishing AND DIVING IMPACTS."

Another (different) proposal involves elimination of all shipwrecks as artificial reefs - going forward... We need to read the documents carefully before we give them a thumbs up on any of their proposals... even something that sounds as nice as "establish Coral Gardens".

 

[Tassi Devil Diver]

Cuzza, where I come from Australia we also claim to have some of the worlds best fisheries and often described as world leading, best practice management and sustainability measures, but is very hard to prevent serial depletion of species targeted by divers which also includes rock lobster, abalone and spear fishing of reef species.

 

[pedro_rj]

There are two threads going on about this subject and Dumpster posted a very important point in the other thread that should be shared here.

Bold and CAPITAL LETTERS are the new black ;D

I see two parallel issues here:

1) spearfishing. As the study I posted suggests, there is fairly strong evidence of damaging effects from this practice. Some are arguing it can be done in a sustainable way. That's a reasonable thesis and I would think it's true, but I must ask again: where is the hard evidence of that? Can someone please link scientific studies showing this to be true? There's gotta be something somewhere demonstrating how a sustainable program and set of rules reconciled species recovery with spearfishing. Knowing and understanding these best practices is very important me thinks.

Not sure how it works in these sustainable areas, but where I dive there is a marine reserve in a small section of the coast with "no touching, no taking" rules. Outside the reserve there is enforcement, most are very conscious and follow all rules etc etc. And yet the difference between inside the reserve and just 10-20 meters out is day and night. If not for the reserve, I would guess it would all be an underwater desert by now (no hard evidence to support that, just my feeling). Needless to say, there is no evil commercial fishing by the coast to take the blame.

Calling it a sport and saying there are worse forms of fishing still don't make it right. In my view to win the public debate it's necessary to have more than supposedly self-evident "truths" set in place by spearos themselves.


2) human impact in general. I think this requires some level of detachment. We must be ready to accept that maybe, MAYBE, in certain important nurseries we need to keep people out. For instance, if it can be demonstrated that excessive numbers of diving students are responsible for severe damage in a major nursery area, we should be open to at least consider the possibility of restricting access or changing practices, no? If the problem are anchors, as cuzza said this can be handled too, and so on.

The dive community can't allow the debate to take extremist contours and vilify a specific group, nor can it ignore its own potential impacts. The way to tackle an extremist position is not to go to the opposite extreme.

 

[CuzzA]

I could be totally wrong about this, but I believe there are far more breath hold spear fisherman than there are scuba fisherman, except for the commercial guys. Scuba is far more expensive than MSF a gun and lungs full of air. Honestly, banning spearing on scuba will do nothing, IMO. Most spearos do both. I was under the impression this group felt diving was having a detrimental impact on the coral reefs. What they're actually saying, IMO, is the FFWC is doing a terrible job managing the fishery and therefore spearfishing on scuba is to blame. So they have singled out one form of harvesting, the easiest target. Despite the reports of the East Coast fisheries rebounding due to better management. The closure of Hogfish this year is a perfect example of the type of sound management that needs to continue. Here on the Gulf, we're also supposed to be reporting our take now as part of an initiative to better estimate quotas and harvesting figures. Gulf Reef Fish Survey

I spent some time reading the groups proposals. They have a bunch of them. One includes banning the use of anchors, which I would be for. Some of the others are nonsense. And DEMA is absolutely right. They have zero data for the South Florida fishery. My guess is this will get crushed unless they present some scientific data.

Here's a link to all of their proposals. Fishing, Diving, Boating & Other Uses/Restoration Draft RMAs | OUR FLORIDA REEFS

Look, I'm all for conservation and sustainability. But I'm finding this group to be laughable. One of their coral reef protection proposals includes the protection of parrotfish because they are herbivores. Which is true, parrotfish are herbivores. They eat the freaking zooxanthellae hosted within the coral's tissue. In other words, they eat coral! I'm not suggesting we cull parrotfish, they are part of the reef ecosystem and play an important role, but if they want to sound intelligent on the issues at least pick a true herbivore species like tangs. And then if you're going to do that, back it up with some science as to why they need protection.

This reminds me of the recent attempt by an extremist environmental group who tried to get the NOAA and the NMFS to ban the trade of ~80 coral species. Come to find out they were just throwing anything at the wall to see what would stick. It was eventually brought down to ~20 species once some science was presented and even still, the 20 corals still on the threatened list is questionable whether they should be there or not. I'm not looking to entertain that topic, only trying to make a point that when groups don't agree with something they'll often throw crap at the wall and hope something sticks and they'll keep doing it until they finally find someone that will agree with them.

 

[dumpsterDiver]

Using the "ban boats and diving on reefs" analogy, that's a hot button topic that will get the people creating the problem to submit reasonable alternatives. However, if the regulating agency just came forward with prohibitions against anchoring, or minimum diver training requirements to dive on those reefs, those same people would be complaining and resisting the same measures they themselves will offer up in the face of a ban.

As an FYI, there already Is an existing ban on anchoring on reefs. I attended a recent meeting where these people were presenting their ideas. I asked: "How will law enforcement be able to keep spearfisherman out of specific MLPA (marine life protection areas) that are sited all over the place and in discontinuous sections of the reef?" Divers ride the current and can drift unknowingly into an MLPA. they could even submerge outside of an MLPA, drift through one while submerged and not ascend until north of the proposed MLPA. How in the world can they enforce this?

I said that reef anchoring is illegal, yet every single weekend I see several private fishing boats anchored on some of the most productive live reef in palm beach county. Damage to large sponges and soft corals is very evident as well. I NEVER hear of enforcement. Previously I have asked if anyone had ever gotten a ticket for reef anchoring and people tend to look away and not answer the question.

However last week i was told that FWC staff had told them that the FWC officer can not dive down and see if the anchor is actually in live reef or not, so without this ability they can NOT and will NOT enforce the existing ban on anchoring.

They made the claim that this will be so much easier, because the MLPA boundaries will be on the LEO GPS.. anybody with a hook in the water in the designated area gets a ticket...

The obvious answer is they should document the gps locations for solid reef and at least START giving people fines for anchoring. The proposals are ridiculously restrictive and burdensome, and if they simply made a decent effort to enforce the existing no anchor LAWS, we would see benefits..

I swear, reading some of these proposals reminds me of 8th grade science reports..

 

[seeker242]

No Florida Authorities have brought forth this ban. This is a group, not the government.

That's not entirely true. It's a community planning process of the Southeast Florida Coral Reef Initiative (SEFCRI), a collaborative, local effort started in 2004 to understand and protect coral reefs. SEFCRI is coordinated by the Florida Department of Environmental Protection’s (FDEP) Coral Reef Conservation Program.

 

[CuzzA]

DD, did you also read how they intend on funding these new proposed regulations? They don't know. Lol. 8th grade is a compliment. This is more like "Are you smarter than a 5th grader."

 

[CuzzA]

That's not entirely true. It's a community planning process of the Southeast Florida Coral Reef Initiative (SEFCRI), a collaborative, local effort started in 2004 to understand and protect coral reefs. SEFCRI is coordinated by the Florida Department of Environmental Protection’s (FDEP) Coral Reef Conservation Program.

I get what you're saying, but they are not an "authority". If they were, their proposals would already be law. The way the post was written sounded like as if this was being proposed by the Florida Government.