Padi Master scuba diver

[boulderjohn]

There are two schools of thought about that. On the one hand you might be more likely in some cases to be asked to play some kind of a role like buddy up with a rookie diver or follow on behind a group to sweep up stragglers if you show a DM or an instructor card. In those cases you're welcome to either accept or refuse depending on your disposition but some people find being asked to contribute to a dive so annoying that they lie about their qualifications in order to avoid the question.

The other thought that I think you need to consider is that *IF* something happens your pockets may not look "zipped shut" to a liability lawyer if you deliberately mislead the dive team as to your qualifications. In accident I can see a lawyer making that claim that if you hadn't lied that that dive team would have made other decisions and that the accident wouldn't have happened, essentially blaming your lie for causing the accident, even if it has nothing to do with it. Remember, lawyers don't care what really happened, all they want is to be able to nail someone for it.

That second bit is why I never lie about my qualifications, and to be honest, while it has happened from time to time, I've never felt that a dive crew asked me to do something that would have caused a conflict if I had declined.

R..

This has been discussed frequently. Here is my take.

In recreational diving situations, I always show an instructor card. I have never been asked to do anything described above, and I don't know anyone else who has either. In fact, it is quite the opposite. An operator with multiple boats or groups of divers will put me with the best group doing the best dives. For example, I was once on a boat with more than 20 divers in Hawai'i. We were divided into three groups. Two groups were raw beginners. In my group, we were told that every diver had at least 500 dives, and you can believe we were treated very differently from the raw beginner groups. In the raw beginner groups, there may have been some professionals who had smugly refused to show their highest card so that they wouldn't be paired with beginners. I don't know.

Not only am I regularly placed with the more advanced divers, I am given a lot more freedom and benefit of the doubt during the dives. I get to participate in collegial discussions with the staff. I get other considerations, including occasional discounts. I have never had the slightest regret about showing that card, and I have received a slew of benefits.

In general, dive operators want professionals to be happy. They want them to return, and they want them to recommend them to students. The last thing they want to do is piss them off by sticking them with a bad dive.

The only time I ever performed any professional duties on a dive were at my suggestion. At the end of a week of diving, I had gotten to know the people pretty well. They had a popular dive coming up, and one of their crew could not make it. They needed another professional in the water to meet their insurance requirements. I offered to fill that role, and they compensated me for it. If I were ever to be asked to work in any way as a professional, which I consider highly unlikely, I would demand compensation.

 

[Oldbear]

Knock on wood...it really doesn't matter what card I show the Dive Operator because I truly try to investigate them before diving with them and try to pick operators that have competent staff for each dive. So far this has worked out quite well for me. On a couple of trips by showing my MSD card or DM card I have had other staff members (and once the owner) join our trip just so we could dive more advance dives...away from the lesser experienced divers that were diving with the regular staff on the regular dive routes. As far as helping out on a dive, I guess it is my human nature to assist if I can and a couple of times I have but I know my limits and stay within them.

Like I said...knock on wood...I have not had a bad experience to date, but have had better than average dives by showing one of my advance C-Cards. :thumbs-up

I guess with me my glass is "half full".

~Oldbear~

 

[Diver0001]

This has been discussed frequently. Here is my take.

....snip....

The only time I ever performed any professional duties on a dive were at my suggestion. At the end of a week of diving, I had gotten to know the people pretty well. They had a popular dive coming up, and one of their crew could not make it. They needed another professional in the water to meet their insurance requirements. I offered to fill that role, and they compensated me for it. If I were ever to be asked to work in any way as a professional, which I consider highly unlikely, I would demand compensation.

My experience is mixed. I've been invited to do dives that were not available to just anyone (quite a few) and I've been asked on a regular basis to fulfill a role in the dive team's plan.

9 times out of 10 it takes the form of "rear guard" to sweep up stragglers

R..

 

[Bob DBF]

Pay for MSD card? My instructor gave me one on a dive after I had completed the requirements. I don't know if I'm just special or he does it for all his students. Actually I know I'm special, but it usually dosen't help me when commercial commerce is involved.

The card dosen't do anything for me, but it spurred my daughter to complete DiveCon and PADI DM which has improved her diving as well as helping her in getting her scientific diving credential.



Bob
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I may be old, but I'm not dead yet

 

[boulderjohn]

Getting back to the big picture, as I suggested earlier, I think that their is a problem in the way continuing education is advertised, which creates the illusion that there are just a few big steps available when in reality there is a huge variety of options for further training. You can customize your continuing education in any way you want, and you can change what you want and go a different direction whenever you feel like it.

Over the years I have gone in a number of different directions in my training. My stack of certification cards is 1.5 inches tall, and I just took another class two weeks ago in which I learned a lot.

And I don't have the MSD certification.

 

[DivemasterDennis]

Here is the opinion of a 60 year old who have been diving for 16 years, and held professional credentials through PADI for 13 of those years.
Master Scuba diver involves open water, advanced open water, rescue diver and 5 specialty certifications. That is a substantial amount of training and it is worthwhile. But it is a personal satisfaction thing.
Divemaster training involves open water advanced open water, rescue diver and efr training as prerequisites, and then much more in depth theory, honing of skills to demonstration quality, leadership and legal issues instruction, and lots of interning. Not all people who receive the certification are active as teaching assistants or dive leaders. However, if you complete divemaster training and keep insurance current, in my experience you will be "left alone" by most dive charters and operators, and allowed to dive independently. That is a HUGE reason from my perspective to have that credential. I am active in working as a dive leader, assisting in some classes, and teaching classes for which my credential qualifies me, including snorkeling, Discover Scuba and and Discover Scuba Diving, and scuba refreshers. That's the PADI line up. Other agencies may have a different list. I actively assist in rescue and advanced open water classes, and occasionally with open water courses. I enjoy it, not because it pays well ( the pay sucks) but because I get 20% off all purchases at my LDS and that is substantial because O buy a lot of gear (3 divers in the family).
I think divemaster training is much more substantial and rewarding than Master Diver, but the focus is different, and its not for everybody. However, I suspect you would take to it. Give it serious thought.
DivemasterDennis
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[Mustard Dave]

Hey thanks guys -This is pretty much as I thought. Basicly pure ego.
Re liability for divemaster-Forgive my stupidity but if I'm NOT working as a DM or even a defacto DM then whats the harm in showing my next highest card when sighning up onto a boat.?

This is a subject that often attracts a lot of bollocks. There is no harm whatsoever. I know a couple who are both instructors at my club. If they go to a dive resort where they are unknown, they always show their AOW cards so they don't get asked to look after inexperienced (or even trainee) divers.

You are not legally required to disclose the fact you are a DM to any dive operator and you do not have an increased duty of care. That is not to say you do not have any duty of care - we all have. If an incident occurred, you would be expected to assist in a manner commensurate with your ability. As a diver with rescue training but no pro certification, so would I. The dive centre is receiving payment and are legally obliged to provide the required personnel to ensure the well being of their customers. They should not be relying on paying customers to provide cover.

Personally, I think people need to just grow a pair. I'd always show my DM card (if I had one). If they wanted me to work for them I could say 'No' or 'Certainly. I charge £120 per hour.'.

 

[Doubler]

As far as C cards go the only card I have EVER been asked to show is NITROX.

 

[HIGHwing]

This is a subject that often attracts a lot of bollocks. There is no harm whatsoever. I know a couple who are both instructors at my club. If they go to a dive resort where they are unknown, they always show their AOW cards so they don't get asked to look after inexperienced (or even trainee) divers.

I use to think this was a logical line of thinking. Now being more informed, I realize lying about your qualifications for personal gain is pointless when the police show up at your home. Now you have to explain why you lied. In my renewed view on topic, I'd rather be as honest as I can from the start. As a professional you always retain two very handy options 1) Informing the charter operator you do not have them listed as additional insured, and 2) Refuse a liability waiver from the client signed under duress (i.e. I don't sign in 5 minutes and I'll miss the dive).

 

[macado]

It's pure marketing bullsh*t...actually I take that back. The courses that lead up to allowing you to get the MSD rating can be very helpful if taught by good instructors, I see nothing wrong with that.

There is absolutely nothing bad about attaining this level of training but you don't need the MSD rating to get it.

Like others have said, it's a personal satisfaction thing and the highest recognition for PADI's recreational diver. Other than that, it sure does sound cool to tell people that you're a "Master Scuba Diver" to the untrained diving masses.

I feel the only reason to get certifications is if they provide me useful skills, experience or are minimum level needed to get on a charter or complete a dive safely. The MSD rating is not required to advance in any level of training within PADI.

If you're willing to pay for the card or an instructor is willing to do the paperwork for you then I guess on harm in having it?