Really Interested in a Pony - What size? How to mount? Other questions!

[lowviz]

What length of hose for the 2nd stage?

Depends on pony. The idea is to keep everything tight and tidy.



Mine is a 28 or 30 inch hose for a 19 cuft cylinder. Two innertube straps keep everything neat. Want to be able to just grab secondary reg and pull to free entire length of hose. Neck ring for top boltsnap. Bandclamp with taco and link to large coldwater boltsnap on bottom. Note the slit lenghtwise tygon tubing (Home Depot) that keeps the bandclamp from corroding the aluminum cylinder.

 

[Rand]

Not trying to turn this into a DIR discussion, but I follow their rigging and hose length for pony/stage/deco bottles. That specifies a 40" hose on an AL40. The way we route it when being breathed (by the diver wearing it) is to deploy it from its stowed position and then drape it from left to right around the back of the neck and then to your mouth. If you had to donate/share it while deployed you simply dip your head and pull the hose over your head.

The 40" hose is plenty long to share it with another diver while slung on you.

I agree with lowviz about that bottle size is going to dictate hose length. You would find a 40" hose loops and hangs way past the bottom of an AL19, and just doesn't lay as tidy as a shorter hose would.

There is some good info on FrogKickDiving that I linked to in the other post that describes how to set up regs/hoses/gauge on a stage bottle.

 

[Colliam7]

The standard practice is to have a typical primary and octo on your first stage on your back gas--no change from how you most likely were initially trained. You put just a 1st and 2nd stage on the pony. You want the ability to donate a reg immediately in case of emergency, and if slinging a pony, that pony reg will be turned off and not immediately ready to be breathed/donated.

Yes. Having a pony should not change your primary / back gas configuration. Having double main cylinders, either manifolded or independent, would. But, that is different from wearing a pony bottle. A pony is NOT supplemental gas, it is a redundant gas supply, therefore a 'reserve' gas.

Some may advocate passing off the pony, which certainly can be done, but I consider the pony MY emergency reserve. What would you do if you passed off your bottle to someone else and then had a catastrophic failure of your back gas yourself? Similarly, if you donated your pony reg first and had that same failure, you would either need to get that reg back or buddy breathe. Rule #1 in a rescue situation is not become a victim yourself. I'm going to do what I can to take care of another diver in an emergency, but if I'm having an emergency myself at the same time, I've got to take care of myself first.

Again, I completely agree. My pony is MY gas, and no one else's. I don't care to hand it off. It will contain enough gas to allow me to get out of a difficult situation, make a normal ascent, make an appropriate safety stop, and surface.

What length of hose for the 2nd stage?

40" is the 'standard' for a slung bottle. If you go with a 30 or 40 cf bottle, slung, get a 40" hose. If you go with a smaller bottle, the length may depend on how you mount it.

 

[uncfnp]

When you sling a pony, do you still have an octo hooked up on your main tank or do you just transfer the 2nd reg to the pony?

The only instance that I know of when a diver may consider eliminating the octopus is in true solo diving when there is obviously no one for you to donate to...and I don't think that's the diving you are after.

What length of hose for the 2nd stage?

I have a thirty and it stores neatly against the tank but I admit that in practice the hose feels a little tight for comfort and that an extra few inches might be nice.

Others may have other practices, but my way is to always donate my octo first and share my back gas with a diver in need, just like I would if I had no redundant gas source, provided I have enough gas to get us both back to the surface (which should be the case if my gas plan was followed--but that's another conversation). My thinking in this is that if we can both get back to the surface on my back gas, then my pony is available for me to use on a second dive.

Some may advocate passing off the pony, which certainly can be done, but I consider the pony MY emergency reserve. What would you do if you passed off your bottle to someone else and then had a catastrophic failure of your back gas yourself? Similarly, if you donated your pony reg first and had that same failure, you would either need to get that reg back or buddy breathe. Rule #1 in a rescue situation is not become a victim yourself. I'm going to do what I can to take care of another diver in an emergency, but if I'm having an emergency myself at the same time, I've got to take care of myself first.

That may differ from how others do things, but that practice is how I usually see it done, and it works for me.

I recall a recent thread that had a pretty good discussion of the pros and cons of which reg to donate, primary, secondary or pony. Obviously gear configuration will play a role in this but as to octo vs pony, I really don't see a down side to donating the pony, if you are certain of handing the possibly near panic diver an open and functioning reg. As to the argument that you are giving up your redundancy, it seems that the dive is pretty much over at that point either way. You will be ascending with this diver, on pony or on your octo in an air share scenario. There is the disadvantage if donating your pony that it may not me available for a second dive but the advantage is that you will not be tied to a diver that may well panic and try to take both of you to the surface. Of course, this viewpoint is coming from a petite female that wants to stay as far away as possible from a panicky diver and from a diver that has never witnessed an OOA situation so is going on pure speculation...

 

[lowviz]

...//.... I have a thirty and it stores neatly against the tank but I admit that in practice the hose feels a little tight for comfort and that an extra few inches might be nice. ...//...

Too short for personal use or too short for donating air?

Same length hose is plenty for me if I have to ascend on my pony. I don't share (stay clipped to) a pony, I'll donate the pony -if donating the primary is not an option.

The way we practice: Notice OOA diver, immediately (but slowly) crack charged pony open, quickly open valve all the way. Unclip bottom boltsnap on pony. Right hand deploys secondary while left hand cradles cylinder. Approach needy diver with secondary in outstretched hand. Check to insure you are not donating secondary upside down. Nearing contact, point mouthpiece down and quickly puff secondary so possibly panicked diver goes for secondary, not you. Immediately (while needy diver is getting onto your pony's secondary) unclip top boltsnap (and ideally reclip to either of needy diver's chest D-rings). Attempt to get behind OOA diver and control their inflator/dump on ascent. The rest of the drill is highly situational...

Other procedures are welcomed for consideration. 'Real rescues are messy and never go by the book.' (TeamLGS quote)

 

[MrChen]

I see how there can be an argument for which reg to offer, pony or octo, but I really want the pony for my own self reliance. If it's dive 1 of 2, I'd want my pony for the 2nd dive. I want my pony for my own safety. I'm not solo diving and if the valve is off, it wouldn't really be available for someone in a panic. If something went wrong with my air, I know I can calmly grab the pony reg and turn the valve.

 

[lowviz]

...//... I really want the pony for my own self reliance. If it's dive 1 of 2, I'd want my pony for the 2nd dive. I want my pony for my own safety. ...//...

So do I, just be open to the possibility that your assumptions may change when you actually see someone in life-threatening distress.

 

[uncfnp]

Too short for personal use or too short for donating air?

Slightly too short for personal use. I would feel a little tug with head movement but that was probably at least partially the way it was slung at that time. I was using a ring and bungee loop to hook the clip under the arm rather then the shoulder D ring so the bottle rode more to the side.

 

[lowviz]

Ah!

Nice way to sling a pony, more like sidemount. Swap the LP hose out for the shortest, yet comfortable size...

 

[MrChen]

Update

I asked my LDS about buying one. To save money (their idea) they said they'd try and find a used one. After 2 weeks they still hadn't found one so I started looking online at prices. I found that LP had the best price, $120. Of course this wouldn't include a vis. So I was talking to my LDS about it and I told them that if they could get a new one for $120 with vis, I'd just opt for a new one. They jumped on it and started ringing me up. They then said it was an easy price to match since it was their regular price and it would also include a fill. I wish they would have told me that was the price earlier! They said a new pony was almost as much as an AL80, which is why they were trying to help me save some money with a used one. $120 is cheaper than a new AL80. They'll also help me build a DIY sling. They had to order the pony, so hopefully I'll have it by next week.

I also bought a new Hog 2nd stage ($89) which I've set up as my primary. I moved my old primary to my necklace. I removed my octo and it will go on the pony bottle. I have 2 spare 40 inch hoses. I know someone said that 40" was long for a 19cu. If it is, then I'll buy a shorter one.

So I need a first stage, a 6 inch high pressure hose, and a naked SPG. And possibly a shorter low pressure regulator hose. Almost there!