Spg

[InTheDrink]

You can ask all the question you want. This forum does have the rule that answers should be in line with the DIR philosophy.


Lets say you had a small leak (and none of your buddies noticed). When you did check your SPG at say 10 minutes you'll notice you have less than expected gas. At this point you start doing down the list of reasons for it. Perhaps you check it again at 15 minutes and you see you are going through it faster than expected. At this point you thumb it, ask for help, etc.



Retractors get jammed. A bungee, I have trouble envisioning how I'd rig a bungee so that it was nice and tight (and out of the way) when I'm not looking at it but still long enough to get it up to my face (or well near it anyhow), around any bottles (without snagging on anything), without snapping back due to the high spring constant.

Thanks for the clarification and wasn't snapping - I just get wary of certain types of answers and I'm new on this forum. And yes, I should review the TOS.

I can understand the rationale better now, so thanks for the explanation - it puts things in a more understandable light. Please understand that I'm not necessarily challenging the concepts - I'm pretty new after all - but trying to understand the thinking behind them. And I need to ask the 'what ifs' so I can really understand.

I guess my question stems a little from the fact that I'm about two inches from being able to see my SPG when clipped by glancing down. Having a tiny bungee would give me those extra two inches that I've always craved for

J

 

[lamont]

I guess my question stems a little from the fact that I'm about two inches from being able to see my SPG when clipped by glancing down. Having a tiny bungee would give me those extra two inches that I've always craved for

sorry, but you should be able to clip and unclip your SPG easily.

its good practice because at some point you're going to manipulating stage bottle clips at that d-ring and if you can't manage a single SPG clip alone, you need to work on it until it becomes second nature.

eventually you'll be able to check your gas while on a scooter, while slinging/dragging bottles, and wearing drygloves... and you'll wonder what the BFD used to be...

 

[TSandM]

eventually you'll be able to check your gas while on a scooter, while slinging/dragging bottles, and wearing drygloves... and you'll wonder what the BFD used to be...

That's so true, Lamont! I remember the first time I tried to check my gas -- I ended up floundering in the silt, and there was no way I could reclip it, so I let it hang for the rest of the dive.

Then, when I added a deco bottle, I almost decided I'd rather run out of gas than have to unclip and reclip the thing.

Now it's a nonevent, but I'm afraid of two bottles . . .

 

[lamont]

That's so true, Lamont! I remember the first time I tried to check my gas -- I ended up floundering in the silt, and there was no way I could reclip it, so I let it hang for the rest of the dive.

Then, when I added a deco bottle, I almost decided I'd rather run out of gas than have to unclip and reclip the thing.

Now it's a nonevent, but I'm afraid of two bottles . . .

a lot of it is just learning how to hold it when you clip off so that your index finger can find the d-ring, straighten it out, and then snap the boltsnap into place...

although when i borrow laura's single tank rig the HP hose is so short that without any slack in it, its annoying to try to clip off...

at the same time, i've snagged by spg on occasion on cave line, so i've thought of shortening up the hose to make it less likely to grab line (some of that can just be fixed by better line awareness, though, and i don't think i snagged it once last trip, so maybe this is more of a non-issue than an issue...).

i've also been known to do some gnarly stuff with cross clipping my spg into stage/deco bottles, which seems to be way more common with two bottles and two extra clips on that d-ring... gotta practice that more...

 

[rjack321]

i've also been known to do some gnarly stuff with cross clipping my spg into stage/deco bottles, which seems to be way more common with two bottles and two extra clips on that d-ring... gotta practice that more...

This becomes mostly an issue of hand & wrist positioning so that all the other stuff is pushed out of the way by your arm & wrist leaving a "clean" section of d-ring to clip into. Its at its worst with full bottle(s) on the leash as that clip will then want to ride "down" the d-ring into the clips of the stages which are on you up front.

 

[ae3753]

That's an interesting point you make. Does DIR not tolerate questions about its own choices? This would be a big turn off for me.

Not as all. Questions are indeed welcomed and encouraged. You'll hear the term "thinking diver" a lot with regards to DIR diving. This only comes about by asking questions and challenging existing procedures and processes.

There is a misconception that DIR divers are not individuals and we simply accept the procedures from some sort of mothership. In fact, we are all individuals who have separately concluded that this style of diving is the best for ourselves and for our team.

Personally, I haven't met a single DIR diver who hasn't ask why? Or can this be improved?

a lot of it is just learning how to hold it when you clip off so that your index finger can find the d-ring, straighten it out, and then snap the boltsnap into place...

That's how I do it as well: How to clip the spg to the hip D-ring

 

[Van Isle]

One reason to unclip to read your SPG that I've found is that it allows me to keep my head up, improving my situational awareness. After practice - and not that much of it, really - it really becomes quite facile. And that's in cold water with dry gloves. Add a deco bottle in the mix (which I have been known to do, just for practice) and it becomes more evident why "DIR" is the way it is: I'm less likely to confuse the backgas SPG for a deco bottle SPG. Unclipping it means I can move it to where I can see it, regardless of extra bottles, reels, or scooters hanging elsewhere in my way. There's much less dangling to get caught on line, or entrapped in other gear.

 

[InTheDrink]

Thanks for the answers again and I understand now.

What I'm taking away is that having the SPG in this position works universally irrespective of singles, doubles and other bottles etc. Standardising the approach means not changing position of instruments depending on the particular dive and hence leaves less room for confusion/error.

The motor skill part of it I'm not bothered by. As long time (now) ex-smoker my fingers are very dextrous and I rarely need to look at what they're doing to do things with them. One fringe benefit I guess. High price to pay you'd probably concur.

Anyhow, thanks for the cogent responses. Just needed to get some answers and thrash it through in my head.

Cheers,
J

 

[leabre]

Thanks for the answers again and I understand now.

What I'm taking away is that having the SPG in this position works universally irrespective of singles, doubles and other bottles etc. Standardising the approach means not changing position of instruments depending on the particular dive and hence leaves less room for confusion/error.

The motor skill part of it I'm not bothered by. As long time (now) ex-smoker my fingers are very dextrous and I rarely need to look at what they're doing to do things with them. One fringe benefit I guess. High price to pay you'd probably concur.

Anyhow, thanks for the cogent responses. Just needed to get some answers and thrash it through in my head.

Cheers,
J

It was tough for me to get used to using the SPG without a AI computer. I look at my air pressure about every 5 minutes. Sometimes 10 if I'm in shallower waters. But with time I've gotten to the point where I don't even need to look at it very often anymore, at any point in the dive my brain somehow knows what my PSI is at a given point (within the dives I do frequently). When I venture deeper, I don't always know but after about 15 minutes (3 checks or so) I can predict what my PSI will be at the next check and so on. It takes practice, but its nothing to stress about, becuase it happens eventually. That's why we plan our gas and dives. When we dive the plan, the plan usually works out as planned.

What's really funny is when I dive with a non-DIR instructor or DM and they have this compulsive need to ask where my air is, I reply without checking the guage and they think I misunderstood the question. Reply again and so often they'll reach for my air and see that it reads what I told them it would be. It makes for interesting discussions in the debriefing.

Just make sure to actively "practice" monitoring your air supply, and predicting where it'll be by the next time you check it, you'll get the hang of it.

As far as the clipping aspect, more or less you'll get used to it. Even now after 120 dives since my UTD Essentials class, I find it instinctive to unclip but sometimes I fumble when clipping it. But it's not a difficult skills to learn if you have the right size bolt snap, hose length, and D-Ring in the correct location on your waist strap. I have a friend that has only 8 dives post OW. From dive #1 last year I put him in a HOG rig but not the long hose and SPG. Two weeks ago for his dive #4 I put him in a long hose and with SPG instead of console computer. Every 5 minutes, when I check my air, I "demonstrated" what I was doing and expected the same of him. I could see it in his eyes he was ready to kill me, it didn't come easy to him. Starting at dive #6 he was doing it on his own. After that, the clipping action was easy "enough" for him. So if that's any indicator, I think you'll get the clipping within a few dives at least.

 

[InTheDrink]

It was tough for me to get used to using the SPG without a AI computer. I look at my air pressure about every 5 minutes. Sometimes 10 if I'm in shallower waters. But with time I've gotten to the point where I don't even need to look at it very often anymore, at any point in the dive my brain somehow knows what my PSI is at a given point (within the dives I do frequently). When I venture deeper, I don't always know but after about 15 minutes (3 checks or so) I can predict what my PSI will be at the next check and so on. It takes practice, but its nothing to stress about, becuase it happens eventually. That's why we plan our gas and dives. When we dive the plan, the plan usually works out as planned.

What's really funny is when I dive with a non-DIR instructor or DM and they have this compulsive need to ask where my air is, I reply without checking the guage and they think I misunderstood the question. Reply again and so often they'll reach for my air and see that it reads what I told them it would be. It makes for interesting discussions in the debriefing.

Just make sure to actively "practice" monitoring your air supply, and predicting where it'll be by the next time you check it, you'll get the hang of it.

As far as the clipping aspect, more or less you'll get used to it. Even now after 120 dives since my UTD Essentials class, I find it instinctive to unclip but sometimes I fumble when clipping it. But it's not a difficult skills to learn if you have the right size bolt snap, hose length, and D-Ring in the correct location on your waist strap. I have a friend that has only 8 dives post OW. From dive #1 last year I put him in a HOG rig but not the long hose and SPG. Two weeks ago for his dive #4 I put him in a long hose and with SPG instead of console computer. Every 5 minutes, when I check my air, I "demonstrated" what I was doing and expected the same of him. I could see it in his eyes he was ready to kill me, it didn't come easy to him. Starting at dive #6 he was doing it on his own. After that, the clipping action was easy "enough" for him. So if that's any indicator, I think you'll get the clipping within a few dives at least.

Good tip. I'll start doing this and see how accurate I am. Sounds like a fun game in any event

My concern with the positioning of the SPG in my original post(s) really was that it made is less easy and therefore less likely to check your gas. But getting into the routine of clipping and unclipping at intervals (dependent on the profile of the dive) doesn't sound unreasonable to me now the rationale behind it has been explained.

Thx,

J