Taken the classes but having hard time getting final cert dives :(

[shark.byte.usa]

Really doesnt seem like all these restrictions are for the better good of the student trying to get certified. Kinda seems more like a mild sales trap Is this typical of all dive shops in phx or did i not do my research good enough?

Ya think! Don't feel bad plenty of people fall into the same trap, including me! Didn't you get the "Evils of the Internet", "The lakes aren't worth diving", "You'll die if you don't breathe our air" and other assorted BS speeches??? Okay Okay so I exagerrated on the last one.

As far as your research, what did that consist of?? Cuz I'm gonna go out on a limb and say S.Sciences has a pretty bad rep (some deserved, some not, mostly due to the GM being an a-hole & very high gear prices. They have a couple DM's and an Instructor or two I respect), to be fair they probably explained the checkout dive process before you signed up and should have covered referalls during the class, along with the restrictions, at least they did in the 2 OW classes I attended. And from your profile it says you found this site BEFORE you actually started class, so ya your research sucked. Sorry!

My advice get your c-card and get it over with, then go dive, dive, dive and have fun and forget about it. And No it's not typical of all shops in Phoenix, but they are all in business to make a buck or two. Try Scuba Specialties (43rd Ave./Bell) for the Westside or El Mar in Mesa for the Eastside. Scubatoys.com is a great place for gear online.

Good luck,
Garrett

 

[Dive-aholic]

Really doesnt seem like all these restrictions are for the better good of the student trying to get certified. Kinda seems more like a mild sales trap Is this typical of all dive shops in phx or did i not do my research good enough?

The extreme measure Scuba Sciences takes to keep students from going elsewhere is not typical. However, lots of shops in lot of cities around the US lean towards that side of the spectrum. Like Garrett said, they're in business to make a buck. Running a dive shop is not an easy task. Making money running a dive shop is even more difficult. There are lots of overhead costs and even more manufacturer restrictions on how their products can be sold. I'd love to have a dive shop, but I don't want what comes along with it. That's one of the reasons my wife and I decided just to teach independently. We don't have overhead costs of a building, etc. We don't have manufacturers or a shop owner dictating to us about our gear. We don't have a shop owner telling us we can only spend X amount of time in the pool or on a dive. We don't have a shop owner telling us we can't dive with our student divers on the training dives that don't require an instructor in the water by standards. I can go on and on with this list.

It's really difficult to do research on something when you know very little to nothing about that subject. Most new divers make the same mistake you did. They do a little research thinking they asked the right questions, but they don't realize all the questions they need to ask. Then either during the training phase or after it they realize they could have done much better. Same thing happened with me and my wife. Only difference was we only had a couple shops to choose from. If I had to do it all over again, I would have gone out of town for my training. As it is, a lot of my advanced training has been completed out of state.

Have you spoken with someone at Scuba Sciences yet?

 

[GreenDiverDown]

At our shop we do referals ANY time a customer requests one. No questions asked... no restrictions... take it anywhere you like. We used do do that free of charge but now charge a nominal fee to organize and process the paper work. We're in the business to make money... but we do that by making our customers happy.

 

[Iroc]

Update...

Well i contacted SSI they told me that there is no reason why i could not get a copy of our training records. They said the origonal was the dive shops property but obtaining a copy should be no problem. I asked if there was typically a fee associated with that and the guy told me he was not sure and it depended on the dive shop. Then i contacted Scuba Sciences and was told "crosstraining wasnt allowed" since teaching methods were so different. i advised him i was not crosstraining and just needed a copy of training records in order for instructor to have a better idea of what our training level was so they could accuratly break down any differences in order to provide the most complete training as possible. I was told i could get copies of skill sets and the basic info regaurding what was done during training but i was not allowed to get a copy of my record. I advised the guy i talked to SSI and they said it should be no problem and i still got the same answer. He asked multiple times why i couldnt check out with them and the answer "its impossible" wasnt enough for him. The guy told me he would talk to the head guy and get back to me. Which if you have ever met him doesnt sound like a good thing lol. Sounds like they would almost rather we never get certified and never enjoy a single day of diving rather than let us do our check out somewhere else :shakehead Boy oh boy what is this world coming to? I work in customer service and if i treated my clients like this i would not be able to pay my bills. Who knows maybe the head guy got laid last night and will have a heart.... Time will tell.

 

[Web Monkey]

times why i couldnt check out with them and the answer "its impossible" wasnt enough for him. The guy told me he would talk to the head guy and get back to me. Which if you have ever met him doesnt sound like a good thing lol. Sounds like they would almost rather we never get certified and never enjoy a single day of diving rather than let us do our check out somewhere else :shakehead Boy oh boy what is this world coming to? I work in customer service and if i treated my clients like this i would not be able to pay my bills. Who knows maybe the head guy got laid last night and will have a heart.... Time will tell.

Send then an email and tell him that 68,000 divers are about to hear how he treats his customers (good or bad).

Terry

 

[Dive-aholic]

He probably knows. I saw several ScubaBoard stickers for sale in his shop up until a few months ago. Either he sold them or he decided not to advertise SB anymore.

BTW, crosstraining is allowed. PADI outlines the steps necessary in its standards.

Any lawyers out there that can tell us whether keeping records from a student is legal or not. I know it's not legal to keep medical records from patients.

 

[Eduardo]

Iroc...

I did the SSI class work with Desert Divers in Tucson and they were very helpful in providing the universal referral form so that I could complete the open water certification in Maui. I ended up getting a PADI card from the shop in Maui.

They also have trips to San Carlos, Mexico to do the OW dives. I just went down there last weekend and it was 82 degrees with 60 ft visibility. You may want to give them a call or PM me if you want more info.

 

[Dive-aholic]

Eduardo, the problem is that iroc did his classroom and pool work with a shop that won't provide the universal referral. They're refusing to do it because they want to keep the money and certification to themselves. Desert Divers won't be able to help iroc and his S.O. because they don't have access to his training records. Without those, they basically have to go through the training all over again!

 

[Eduardo]

Dive aholic: I understand the situation clearly. It wouldn't hurt to contact another SSI training center as they may be able to assist in getting this taken care of without going through the entire class again. Perhaps they could ask SSI corporate to intervene.

FYI: I don't have any affiliation with Desert Divers, just found them to be very helpful in providing private training due to scheduling conflicts with their classes. They went the 'extra mile' for me.

 

[GreenDiverDown]

Dive aholic: I understand the situation clearly. It wouldn't hurt to contact another SSI training center as they may be able to assist in getting this taken care of without going through the entire class again. Perhaps they could ask SSI corporate to intervene.

FYI: I don't have any affiliation with Desert Divers, just found them to be very helpful in providing private training due to scheduling conflicts with their classes. They went the 'extra mile' for me.

This would be fun!

I think Desert Divers is on Scuba Sciences' 'not to be trusted' list.