The true costs in the Certification fee

[Redshift]

Good luck finding a continuous supply of people willing to volunteer so you can save money on paying people for their time.

BSAC for their recreational levels.
CMAS in some areas when also going through clubs.

Sometimes it's possible, sometimes it's not. Being cheap does not always equate to being bad.

The problem with cheap certifications is that for the majority of the businesses, there are costs that need to be covered and when something is really cheap, they can be cutting on fundamental things. And many divers may not know what to expect and therefore not know if things were done properly or not.

 

[mac.calder]

$25 is low for cert fees... considering at least 2 cert agencies I know of charge about AU$70 (about US$65) to send out a piece of plastic with your name and photo on it.

When you break down a course into it's components, it is really easy to see where the money goes... Let's take AOW - you paid $350 & as a part of this course were expected to make 5 dives in open water. Rounding down a bit, let's say that the course materials are $70, air fills are included in the cost - let's say $6 a fill 'retail', we will assume that these were all shore dives to remove any boat fees etc, that you are supplying your own equipment & the dives were conducted over 2 days - 4 day dives and a night dive at about an hour in duration, 1 hour between each dive for pre/post dive briefs SI & change tanks, 1 hour before each dive to setup and pre-brief, 1 hour after the last dive to de-brief and to pack down the gear - basically 7 hours day 1 and 5 hours day 2 - 12 hours total. It works out to about $20 an hour. Even IF there are 4 other students on the course with you without adding a DM or assistant instructor, that $100 an hour we are now sitting on has to contribute towards the instructors PLI, shop costs, possibly pool time etc.

Courses are not in any way shape or form a money spinner. They bring people through the door in the hope that they will then buy "stuff"

 

[CamG]

I agree with Redshift on this one.
It is a sad day to be slighted on life support training because of cash.
Would it be wiser to be patient seek out proper training despite the cost?

Like mentioned before I have been fortunate to know instructors who have worked with me financially to make it possible to continue training.
I have assisted them, traded for training, worked over time, etc.
There was a time I would have carried everyones tanks just to get to dive!
Well ok that was yesterday but anyway still love diving.
To feed the need you do what you got to do!

CamG

 

[hroark2112]

Most businesses won't give you a breakdown of their costs. Why should they??

Call a plumber to your home. You're not going to get an invoice showing what the plumber gets paid, how much his truck costs per mile, how much insurance costs are, material costs, waste and expendable costs, licensing costs, office expenses, etc.

Dive instruction is a business. If they don't make money they don't stay in business and then you get no service, no air fills, etc.

 

[TMHeimer]

Most businesses won't give you a breakdown of their costs. Why should they??

Call a plumber to your home. You're not going to get an invoice showing what the plumber gets paid, how much his truck costs per mile, how much insurance costs are, material costs, waste and expendable costs, licensing costs, office expenses, etc.

Dive instruction is a business. If they don't make money they don't stay in business and then you get no service, no air fills, etc.

Agree. As well, I have found that the costs of basic courses through various dive shops don't really differ by a whole lot. Maybe $50-$100 at the most? I have no experience comparing fees for instruction from one club to another. In fact I wonder how many clubs have instructors that teach (for pay or not)? I disagree that volunteers do a better job than paid people. I feel there are good and bad with both. In education, you have good paid classroom teachers and bad--also good volunteer coaches and bad. Regarding scuba, I have taken courses with 8 different (paid) instructors from 3 different shops. Although obviously some were better than others, none weren't thorough enough for my tastes.

 

[MXGratefulDiver]

I usually teach private or semi-private classes. If I teach an OW class my costs are as follows:

Student materials: $60 per student
Pool time: $25 per hour if I share with a local dive shop ... $150 typical per class
Equipment for students: $10 per student per session ($40 if we can get through pool in two sessions and do all the checkout dives in two days)
Certification fees: $22 per student, including shipping fees to my home

If I do a semi-private class my costs (at best) per student are 60 + 75 + 40 + 22 = $197

I charge $500 for a semi-private class. That means my "profit" is around $300 per student ... assuming we don't need more pool time or checkout dives. For that $300 I spend about 20 hours class time, minimum 6 hours pool time, minimum 12 hours open water time. Then figure in travel time and expenses, insurance, agency membership dues, and wear/tear on my equipment. And if extra pool or OW time is needed, I eat that cost.

That isn't a whole lot of money ... but since the OP thinks that scuba instructors should work for free, and demands a quality class, I suppose I'm doing pretty darn well all things considered ...

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

 

[hroark2112]

The basic classes are cheap. Take some tech courses and then call us. My rebreather class was pricy, as it should be.

 

[alewar]

In my experience diving clubs are the way to go. I pay less than 20€ per month and get:

Unlimited air fills
Complete set of gear (old but still good)
Diving insurance similar to DAN
Pool sessions up to twice per week
CMAS-Training once per year ( from * to ***)
A big pool of buddies to choose from

All of that for 20 bucks per month is a no brainer. Plus the social activities etc. that are also very nice.

 

[Lorenzoid]

I don't want instructors to work for slave wages any more than I want my airline pilot or any other professional charged with the safety of others to work for slave wages. Sure, if someone wants to volunteer his time to teach me, I'll gladly accept. But aside from that unusual scenario, I expect people as a general rule to give their best effort when they're adequately compensated. Part of the reason many OW courses suck is that they're taught by instructors who are minimally qualified to teach them, and the wages for instructors of that caliber are low. If I want to be taught a thorough course by a great instructor who goes the extra mile, it ought to cost me what his time is worth.

 

[swimmer_spe]

So, a few points now that I have access to internet again...

1) You may not be told what the plumber makes, but they have an hourly rate plus parts.

2) My AOW, I have all my equipment, and I paid for my tank fills.

3) I do not want free. I want to pay a fee, and get the value out of it. I am paying for your knowledge, I should not be the one teaching YOU... (telling my instructor that there is a high current and him arguing with me. I was right.)

4) Regardless of the course, you should get your money's worth.

5) I respect that there is 'overhead' to pay. I also respect that people's time is worth something. I am willing to pay for your time, as long as the quality is there.