traditional vs. bpw

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I'll try not to make it sound like propoganda but here are some things I like about a bp/wing over either a vest or a back inflate bc...they're all bc's I guess.

With a wing my chest area is clear.

The wing keeps the air close to the tank which in some configurations is where lots of the weight is. When not inflated it wraps around the tanks. That combined with the clear chest are make for a very streamlined package.

The backplate also helps place weight where I need it. That does make trim easier since the goal is to have the center of buoyancy and the center of gravity (not exactly scientific terms maybe) in the same place. We see lots of head up divers. If the air is up high and the weight is down low you have those apposing forces trying to torque you one way or the other. This is of course far more noticeable in cold water where heavier exposure protection and more weight is used. Weight pouches may seem convenient but is that where you need the weight? As an example when I dive in a 7 mm wet suit with an AL tank (not that AL tanks make much sense in cold water but I have a bunch of them) I on;y have 4 pounds on a weight belt. compare that to the poor head up divers in the same cold water who probably have between 16 and 26 pounds on their waist in pouches or a belt. And I don't want to leave out all the over stuffed weight pouches with worn out velcro I've retrieved off the bottom for people. So many of those bc's are designed for warm water use which is ok but dive shops should stop pushing them at new divers who are going to be diving cold local waters.

Don't overlook the rest of your configuration. I wear my backup around my neck though the bc wouldn't seem to be a factor there. The only thing I place on the end of a high pressure hose is a an SPG. I don't know what it is about an HP hose that make it someplace people like to put computers and compasses but it never made any sense to me. I keep my HP hose on the short side and clip it off to my left hip d-ring. Try finding a bc with a left hip d-ring in the right place, especially one that isn't all floppy. Again it's more streamline than a LONG HP hose. I put my depth gauge/bottom timmer on my right wrist. That way while ascending, descending or any other time I can always see it and my right hand is free to do things like donate air in a hurry. We use very specific air donation procedure that works real well and the procedures you use have an effect on what you want for equipment. The right hand removes the primary from the mouth, twists to point the mouthpiece down (so it doesn't free flow filling the OOA divers face with bubbles) and the arm extends to offer the reg. The left hand can be used to put the backup on your own mouth after the primary has been extended. You want a hand available to start and not clutching some consol that's big enough to use as a boat paddle. My left hand is free to make buoyancy adjustments either by way of the inflator/deflator or the bottom pull dump (string). All the while the SPG is neatly clipped out of the way. That all workes much easier for me than trying to juggle some giant consol on a long hose...add a light to the mix like on a night dive and you start to run out of hands.

I wear backup lights on my shoulder straps clipped off to the drings on the shoulders of the harness. Again bc's that do have d-rings all put them in goofy places and you don't have the harness strap to bungie the light to. The reason for keeping backup lights there is the way they are deployed. You turn it on before deplopying it and lift up which slides the bungie up out of the way. Now you can use the light without unclipping it but if you do want to unclip it you'll find it if it's dropped because it's already on.

The fact that the chest and hi area is open I have d-rings where I want them makes it easier to sling a decompression, stage or pony (don't tell any one I said pony). The hip area being open makes room for a canister light and the harness belt gives you a place to mount one. Try mounting a can light on most bc's.


What about expandability? I can keep my whole configuration exactly the same and switch between a small wing for a single tank or a larger one for using doubles. Need a new harness? A couple dollars worth of webbing is all it takes. Going to move on to more advanced diving and add equipment. You make additions without having to change what you already have as far as configuration.

Like most other people I started with a jacket the dive shop sold me and I didn't know anything else even existed. I moved to a back inflate (a ranger). after dinking around for a long time trying to get all the different pieces of equipment to click, I finally have up on the ranger, tech, techpack and jacket and just went to a harness and wing and all those little problems went away.

Can you do a decent job of diving with what's been termed here a "conventional bc" I suppose so but I long ago ran out of reasons why I would want to. If you use a bp/wing without going the rest of the way to a Hogarthian like configuration and learning to use it then you only get a few of the advantages and there isn't as huge of a difference between a wing and any other bc. Put all of it together though and the difference is like night and day.
 
mnj1233:
Gets very old hearing same DIR rhetoric with no reason why its better that way. MNJ





What DIR rhetoric? The question was about BP/W which doesn't, per se, have anything to do with DIR except that they like 'em too. The Zealots (what ever happened to the Knights Scublar?) probably don't care if you go diving in a kilt with a
set of bagpipes under your arm for buoyancy. The question was, is there any reason not to switch or try it now and were there any special steps he might be skipping. The answer to his question, is no.

Non-DIR BP/W Zealot
 
evad:
What DIR rhetoric? The question was about BP/W which doesn't, per se, have anything to do with DIR except that they like 'em too. The Zealots (what ever happened to the Knights Scublar?) probably don't care if you go diving in a kilt with a
set of bagpipes under your arm for bouancy. The question was, is there any reason not to switch or try it now and were there any special steps he might be skipping. The answer to his question, is no.

Non-DIR BP/W Zealot

Relax!!!!! I simply was acknowleging a reply that I thought was direct, to the point and exactly what the original post asked for. As far as DIR rhetoric, I just dont like replies such as "B/P or Die" which Ive read more than once. If one truly subscribes to DIR than same person owes an explanation as to the benefits of their philosophy when responding. Rick wrote his opinion and I appreciated and respct it. Nuf Said!!!
 
mnj1233:
Relax!!!!! I simply was acknowleging a reply that I thought was direct, to the point and exactly what the original post asked for. As far as DIR rhetoric, I just dont like replies such as "B/P or Die" which Ive read more than once. If one truly subscribes to DIR than same person owes an explanation as to the benefits of their philosophy when responding. Rick wrote his opinion and I appreciated and respct it. Nuf Said!!!




I am relaxed. I just wanted to make the crack about the BPBC.
 
evad:
What DIR rhetoric? The question was about BP/W which doesn't, per se, have anything to do with DIR except that they like 'em too. The Zealots (what ever happened to the Knights Scublar?) probably don't care if you go diving in a kilt with a set of bagpipes under your arm for buoyancy.

Extremely unsafe if you're diving somewhere spearfishing is allowed.
 
evad:
You've already exprienced the drastic regression. Skip as many steps as possible.

Hey, is a jacket BCD regression if you've dived with a horsecollar BCD, or is it an improvement despite what holds the tank on with a horsecollar?
 
asaara:
Extremely unsafe if you're diving somewhere spearfishing is allowed.


I would think a bp/w would be much safer in a spearfishing environment....I've never heard of a spear punching through a 1/4" SS backplate before.

Of course, the likelihood of taking a spear to the back are extremely small, but then if you've ever hunted on state land, you know that small likelihoods still can happen...

On the bp/w vs. BCD question, if you feel you're "ready" for a bp/w, then try one and see if you are. Try before buy though. Some people will find they just don't like it. My wife currently dives a non-DIR bp/w (one some members would call "trash") and she loves it. She loves the fact that she has finally found a BCD to fit her, as she has some non-traditional sizing requirements (the term "all legs and a head" comes to mind). The bp/w does come with pockets (extra bucks), and they seem to be similar to what you get in "traditional" BCD's. The best upside in my mind is that you don't have to buy a whole new BCD if something fails or you want to upgrade. If you want bigger wing, you buy a new wing. If you want more pockets, you buy more pockets. Much less upkeep cost. The biggest downside is that the dang things are expensive at the start, esecially if you're looking for something other than a strap and some plate steel.

Basically, the most important thing is to get out there and try it. If you like it, and you'll know what you really like as you try different things, you'll slowly gravitate to the one you'll end up owning. Who knows, you may just love the idea of a kilt and bagpipes.
 
mnj1233:
As far as DIR rhetoric, I just dont like replies such as "B/P or Die" which Ive read more than once.

Can you point us to those replies? I just did a search for that and could not find any posts like that. I would really love to see some so I can laugh at them.:D
 
steveann:
I would think a bp/w would be much safer in a spearfishing environment....I've never heard of a spear punching through a 1/4" SS backplate before.

Of course, the likelihood of taking a spear to the back are extremely small, but then if you've ever hunted on state land, you know that small likelihoods still can happen...
I think he was referring to the kilt/bagpipe setup, not the bp/w :)
 
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