Trip Report: My Experience in a Koh Tao Diving Factory

[lord khram]

I was just wondering why people are so afraid to post the names of operations who, in their opinion, are negligent or "below the bar"?

I agree, I think the bad boys should be named to warn others, as long as posts are not done vindictively to fuel personal vendetas.

 

[DevonDiver]

... my status from day-to-day (fun diver, DMT, etc) has zero do with the credibility and accuracy of my report.

I disagree. Your status as a customer will effect the perspective of your report A LOT.

From reading your initial report, it does sound sometimes like you are a disgruntled DMT, who couldn't get his head around the expectations upon you as part of a 'professional' team member.

If you were just there as a fun diver, and not involved with assistant any instructor/courses, then it sounds like you failed to shop around and find a dive center that catered for your specific preferences.

As for the comments about 'fraud'. Could it have been that the instructor was refering to a specific company policy not to allow OW divers to dive unsupervised? Any scuba company is within its rights to set any standard or principle that it wants...

For issues like liability, logistics etc, I know of many scuba companies that do not allow divers (of varying levels) to dive unsupervised.... This is world-wide, not just in Koh Tao. I've even been told that I have had to dive with a DM before (as a tech diving instructor with 3500+ dives). It caused me no offence and I never thought that it was fraud, because my certifications said I didn't 'have' to be supervised...

That said, I do concur that some of the dive schools on Koh Tao are very definitely 'sausage factories' for OW and AOW qualifications. The PADI dive centers on Tao do more certifications per annum than the rest of Thailand combined. This is due to the exceptionally economical price of courses, coupled with the location of Tao as a pre/post stop-off for backpackers visiting the Full Moon Party.

Having dived in many locations across the globe, I found that I learnt a lot during my year on Koh Tao working as an instructor. I had never been exposed to 'mass market' diving before and that experience certainly improved my logistical management of courses, time management and ability to achieve results within definite time-scales.

I know that some schools on Tao do set strict targets for their instructors, in respect of 'continuing education' of students. If one specific instructor chose to unethically persue those targets, then it should not be used as an example to judge the general diving industry on Tao or across Thailand. From a personal perspective, I do not feel that there is any harm with encouraging students to develop their scuba experience and education by continuing courses. What could ever be negative about doing more training???

If you were seeking leisurely pleasure diving, then there are literaly dozens of smaller schools that advertise a more 'made-to-measure' diving service, where they plan their schedules to avoid the crowded sites, keep small groups and, generally, offer a more relaxed experience. Of course, you pay a premium for this premium service....

To cut to the quick.... your report sounds like it could basically be condensed to...

"I paid bottom-dollar to dive with a mass-market economical diving center, and was extremely disappointed not to recieve the highest standards of service..."

Kind of like compaining that you weren't provided with silver cutlery at McDonalds....

 

[lord khram]

I agree here Devondiver.
Generally speaking in simple terms my experiences show, a DC who's core business is diver training, particularly those that specialise in instructor internships do not provide the best environment for day customers that simply want to dive.
Also in the reverse a DC who's core business is 'middle aged' divers who are not looking to do everything on a tight budget is not necesarilly the best place for a backpacker who wants to become an instructor.
But also it is not always easy to know what to expect on a dive trip untill you are actually there, as a lot of shops are good at telling pottential customers what they want to hear to win a sale.
This at times can be most frustrating particularly if you are on holiday for a short spell and you waste your valuable time diving with a DC that perhaps does not best suit your requirements due to people being economical with the truth. This has happened to me numerous times around the world.

 

[funrecdiver]

As for the comments about 'fraud'. Could it have been that the instructor was refering to a specific company policy not to allow OW divers to dive unsupervised? Any scuba company is within its rights to set any standard or principle that it wants...

That is not what happened. I stated clearly what happened. The instructor repeatedly and clearly told his OW students that when they are OW certified can only dive with a DM or Instructor (he did not say "only in our resort"); and they must get their AOW certification to dive without a DM or Instructor. Since I was there, and I heard it repeated, and other students talked about it with me after class, and you were not there, and you have no idea what happened, I can tell you that your reply is off target and inaccurate. The Instructor did not say "this is not a PADI standard it is our dive center policy, yadda, yadda, yadda).

To cut to the quick.... your report sounds like it could basically be condensed to... "I paid bottom-dollar to dive with a mass-market economical diving center, and was extremely disappointed not to receive the highest standards of service..."..

Yes, that not really correct. The main reason I decided not to dive there was the "sell sell sell" dive factory business model and the fact an Instructor lied to students (misrepresented PADI standards) about the OW certification. What you are saying is not completely true. Yes, Koh Tao is cheaper than most of Thailand. Yes, I did experience poor quality of service, but only from a few of the "lower level" (not management) staff. I reported that I received great service from the management team; hence your "cut to the quick" is a complete distortion of my trip report, LOL.

I agree, I think the bad boys should be named to warn others, as long as posts are not done vindictively to fuel personal vendetas.

Yes, there are two sides to this discussion. As I have mentioned before, it is my personal "policy" never to "name names" when I am reporting a negative trip report. This is my choice. My "personal policy" is to only "name names" when I have a very positive experience. Some people call this "sing their praises".

Others are certainly welcome to visit dive centers and publish trip reports and "name names" when they are very unhappy (as you have done in Pattaya, LK). However, that is not my style, for better or for worse. As long as posters post within the ScubaBoard TOS they should be "free" to post as they desire. The main problem is not posting within the TOS, IMHO, not individual posting styles.

Also, another poster mentioned earlier something about "why are people afraid to name names".... which I thought was interesting. I am not "afraid" to "name names", I simply don't like to "name names" when I post something negative about a dive center.

Even PADI HQ has asked me to "name the center and instructor" who repeated told OW students they could not dive without a DM or Instructor until they were AOW certified, but I kindly refused. Maybe the instructor was under a lot of pressure to pay his bills? I don't know. To me, it was seriously wrong, but I don't want anyone to get in trouble over violating a PADI standard.

That is just me..... others can do as they please

 

[stevenl]

Even PADI HQ has asked me to "name the center and instructor" who repeated told OW students they could not dive without a DM or Instructor until they were AOW certified, but I kindly refused. Maybe the instructor was under a lot of pressure to pay his bills? I don't know. To me, it was seriously wrong, but I don't want anyone to get in trouble over violating a PADI standard.

I don't understand this. You don't want him to violate standards and would like high quality training, but at the same time you refuse to improve the quality of training where you can.

Sorry, but IMO: don't complain about something and refuse to do something about it when you can. If you don't want him to get into trouble, don't mention it in the first place.

 

[RussBKK]

That is not what happened. I stated clearly what happened. The instructor repeatedly and clearly told his OW students that when they are OW certified can only dive with a DM or Instructor (he did not say "only in our resort"); and they must get their AOW certification to dive without a DM or Instructor. Since I was there, and I heard it repeated, and other students talked about it with me after class, and you were not there, and you have no idea what happened, I can tell you that your reply is off target and inaccurate. The Instructor did not say "this is not a PADI standard it is our dive center policy, yadda, yadda, yadda).

I find this very odd indeed. Every OW Student would have been issued with the OW Manual which clearly defines their stutus as an OW Diver once the course has been completed. If the instructor is lying to a group of seven or eight students I would have thought at least one of them would have have noticed?

 

[funrecdiver]

I don't understand this. You don't want him to violate standards and would like high quality training, but at the same time you refuse to improve the quality of training where you can.

Sorry, but IMO: don't complain about something and refuse to do something about it when you can. If you don't want him to get into trouble, don't mention it in the first place.

You are certainly entitled to your opinion and you can post as you feel appropriate. I will post as I feel appropriate. I don't "name names" in public when writing a negative trip report and I will not go the other extreme and not post a trip report at all because I do not "name names".

Yes, I am surely wrong not to report to PADI, but I did not and will not. I like giving people the "benefit of the doubt". That does not mean I must exclude myself from ever writing a trip report.

One of the great things of life is that we don't all have to think alike, talk alike or agree and we are free to do as we feel is best, based on the situation. Since I was the person who had the experience and I am the person who actually saw the situation, how to handle it, is my judgment call.

Cheers.

 

[stevenl]

Fine, your opinion. But don't moan about something you can do something about but refuse to do so. And that is my opinion.

 

[funrecdiver]

Fine, your opinion. But don't moan about something you can do something about but refuse to do so. And that is my opinion.

Make that 'should' and you're correct.

IMHO, I did not "moan" about anything. I wrote a factual trip report. I could care less if this particular dive factory improves or not. It is not my problem. I am the customer, not a PADI QOS consultant. You can Google Koh Tao and "dive factory" and you will see many reports and comments (I saw them after I posted my trip report), BTW.

In fact, I am starting to see that it is pretty much a waste of time to post any objective trip report as an actual dive customer unless you are talking about how "great" things are. No dive center operator or regional instructor questions your motives when you post great things. So, let's begin We don't want to be a "moaner" now do we?

Koh Tao is a beautiful island. The water is blue. The diving is great. I might see a whale shark!"

Koh Tao is a beautiful island. The water is blue. The diving is great. I might see a whale shark!"

Koh Tao is a beautiful island. The water is blue. The diving is great. I might see a whale shark!"

Koh Tao is a beautiful island. The water is blue. The diving is great. I might see a whale shark!"

Koh Tao is a beautiful island. The water is blue. The diving is great. I might see a whale shark!"

Koh Tao is a beautiful island. The water is blue. The diving is great. I might see a whale shark!"

Koh Tao is a beautiful island. The water is blue. The diving is great. I might see a whale shark!"

Koh Tao is a beautiful island. The water is blue. The diving is great. I might see a whale shark!"

Koh Tao is a beautiful island. The water is blue. The diving is great. I might see a whale shark!"

Koh Tao is a beautiful island. The water is blue. The diving is great. I might see a whale shark!"

Must I promise to write this on the "board" 100 times, like in elementary school?

Or should I post another thread? Apologizing for actually trying to be factual, objective and honest? And only say a bunch of nice things about a Koh Tao dive factory?

Would that satisfy you?

Or would you simply prefer I not post any more here? I am perfectly OK with that as well, really.

 

[stevenl]

You picked the wrong guy, I have been critical of Koh Tao diving for a long time.

Also, IMHO, the comments you are receiving have nothing to do with the message but with the tone in which they are set, as has been pointed out to you numerous times.

But up to you how you want to take things.