Short Open Water course

[dumpsterDiver]

Today I called a local dive shop to inquire about the details of geting my 10-yr old son certified (since I've not been an active instructor for a long time). I was told that the complete course was $450 and that since he was so young that it was the executive course (which I think was equivalent to a private class).

This course involved home study of the book, completion of knowledge reviews at home and then training is begun. The gentlemen indicated that the training would take a long time, probably almost an entire day, something like 6-8 hours. He explained that the 6-8 hrs would conist of all necessary pool training as well as review of academics and also completion of the final exam.

I was amazed! He was telling me that a 10-yr old would probably require about 3-5 hours for the "book learning" and then about 3 hrs in one long session in the pool. After that it was off to the boat for 4 certification dives on some later day!

I asked if I could attend the class and the answer was "no" unless I paid the full $450 fee (it seems that my presence would be disruptive to my son's progress, unless I was paying a bunch of money). I even explained that I was a retired instructor, but could only monitor the training if I paid the full $450 class fee.

I was amazed that the instructor was guessing that it would take only 3 hours to complete all pool skills. He did admit that some students take longer, 8 or even more hours sometimes. He never inquired if the kid had any experience in snorkeling or any "unofficial" scuba experience.

At the end of the conversation, I asked what certification...PADI....

I've been training the kid myself, but would like to recognize his accomplishments by getting him formally certified (our last dive was a night dive two days ago). However, it seems that PADI must be getting even EASIER than I could believe.

I think he and I will just continue to dive and slowly review an old dive manual and forget about certification. I didn't think the cost was too high for a private class, but there is no way in my mind that a few hours in a pool is going to cut it for anyone other than an exceptional student or someone who already knows how to dive.

I wouldn't dream of letting my 10-yr old go off on a boat to complete certification dives in the ocean without my presence.

 

[300bar]

As said time and again,PADI is not getting any easier,but that instructor was.
For a standard OW,we take atleast 7-8weeks.academics and pooltraining.
2-4 day's of checkout dives

As for you being along for the training....Well I do understand their point,parants ARE disruptive.
As for being along for the checkout dives, that would just add to the fun for the kid.

 

[ItsBruce]

When I started to read the original post and got to the bit about "training would take a long time, probably almost an entire day, something like 6-8 ...," I thought it was about to continue "times." I was amazed when it said "hours." When my kid went through his certification training, it was private because of his age and schedule. However, there were several days of academics and several days of pool sessions followed a week later by a two tank dive in the ocean. The instructor encouraged me to participate all the way through. My kid's final ocean dive was a referral while he and my wife were in Hawaii ... and was conducted by none other than SB's own Roger (of Lisa and Roger).

In any event, the instructor referred to in the original post is not one I'd ever use.

 

[Dive-aholic]

It's not PADI. Four checkout dives in one day is a standards violation. Get it in writing, then report the jerk! I can barely get the classroom portion done in one day, let alone trying to add 5 confined water dives to that!

 

[ppo2_diver]

Unfortunately, OW classes like this are the norm. Instead of focusing on student performance, many dive stores will focus on a time line. Thus telling the perspective OW student that the course could be completed in xx time frame giving the perspective student the impression that xx is how long it will take. I tell perspective OW students it can take as little as 4 full days or as many as 12 full days. It depends on the students performance during the class.

 

[ppo2_diver]

It's not PADI. Four checkout dives in one day is a standards violation. Get it in writing, then report the jerk! I can barely get the classroom portion done in one day, let alone trying to add 5 confined water dives to that!

I know a dive store that does OW classes in two days. Yes, classroom, confined water, and open water in two days!!! It's a scary world we live in.

 

[dumpsterDiver]

It's not PADI. Four checkout dives in one day is a standards violation. Get it in writing, then report the jerk! I can barely get the classroom portion done in one day, let alone trying to add 5 confined water dives to that!

Sorry he did not say how many days the openwater dives would require. I should have made that clear.

 

[Andy077]

My O/W was similar, got the books ahead of time, took a couple weeks on my own to go through it (between work, night grad school, and part time ski instructing, my free time is somewhat limited! ) then 3 hours of classroom on a thursday night, that was mostly upsell from the LDS, and sat and sun in the pool, 8-3 or so, with only short breaks. Checkout dives were over two days, at the same spot, never got deeper than 20 feet or so. NAUI. needless to say, doing my AOW somewhere else.

I should add, as a ski instructor, parents ARE ALWAYS a disruption. Even the most well-meaning parent, and well behaved child. The reason is simple, mom and dad are the Authority Figure, and when they are around, it's hard to get the child to give that authority to the instructor, they will usually, and subconsciously, look to the parent for confirmation for everything. It's frustrating for the instructor, my usual method when parents ask if they can watch Junior's lesson is "You can see the teaching area from the bar, go relax, have a drink, we'll see you at 3:00."

 

[robint]

also, the kid can be anxious if the parent is present and not follow what the instructor is doing/saying. I have seen this first hand, as my husband is an instructor. Some parents insist on "watching" the class. They end up being a problem in most cases as they just can't stay out of it (they think they are helping). I have seen some fantastic parents though who told the kid to listen to the instructor and not pay any attention to them. But that is rare. Usually the kid keeps looking over at parents for reassurance or to defend them if the instructor tells them they did something wrong (my hubby had one student refuse to do something once as his parents told him he didn't have to do it that way. Ugghhh. Parents were then told that the kid would not get certified, period. They finally backed off).

Yes, some 10-11 year olds can get the pool session skills pretty quickly. Some need longer, just like some adults need longer. It all depends on the individual. With a private class, skills can sometimes go very quickly. Classroom sessions always go FAST with kids as they are used to studying and taking tests, they usually do better that the adults on all the written stuff, tables, etc.

OW cert dives are done over 2 days, PADI doesn't allow more than 3 "training" dives per day due to task-loading concerns. The OW certification here at our LDS takes 2 weekends - 12 hour classroom/pool on Saturday and Sunday, then OW the following weekend. That is with a regular class of students age 12-up.

robin

 

[Rick Inman]

I should add, as a ski instructor, parents ARE ALWAYS a disruption.

This is an instructor based comment, not a customer based comment. Does the instructor think, What's best for the student, or What's easiest for me?

I took BOW at age 13 and my dad was with me. Granted, he was in the same class, but still, it didn't matter. What mattered was having him with me. And then, we dived together through my teen years. The teen years are often difficult on the father/son relationship, and I believe that my dad's insistence on diving with me and being my dive buddy every weekend as I worked my way from adolescent to young man was the greatest thing he could have done. We shared something together that was important and that we both loved, and I stayed close to him because of it. It wasn't just the diving, it was the bookwork, the pool work, the boat rides to the CA Channel Islands, doing skills together, and exploring the unknown as a father-son team. Underwater I learned to trust him with my life, and that made it easier for me to trust him with the complications of maturing into a man on the surface.

I'm sorry for those instructors that feel a dad's wanting to share this experience with their son is "a disruption", and if they really care for the young student they should promote the father being involved and a full part of the scuba education process, even if it makes the class a little more work for the instructor.

And besides, keeping them together will end up selling more gear and more trips and more classes and build customer loyalty. Sheesh! No wonder dive shops have trouble staying in business...

Now I'm 50 and my dad is near 80. I just got back from a deep wreck penetration class on the Jodrey (240' at the bottom), and I couldn't wait to call my dad and tell him all about it.

He was proud of me.

Good for you, DD!