Responsibility to insta-buddy

[timle]

Yes, you are right - I do have something against photographers. I guess I kind of told him, stay close, or you are on your own. In mexico, you are required by law to have guided dives, with a DM. So there is no options out. When you have 2 couples (husbands and wives), and 2 solo divers - it is kind of hard to opt out of your buddy pairs.

No its not. If you have this much against photogs your answer should be - I'm not going to make these dives.

I guess my point is, most buddy pairs seems to work out well, except those with photographers. These folks are very self centered, and do not make good buddies. But why should a non-photographer be a dedicated baby sitter for them?

Do a search there are buddy horror stories all the time on this site that are not photog-based.

If I had my options, I would prefer to be a solo diver in these "groups".

Sounds like 2 other divers were solo, why did you not have the option if they did?

In the Yucatan penisula, if you don't stay close to your DM leader, you will get lost in the current. Based on my previous experience, to keep from getting separated from the group (and risk surfacing when the boats are not anchored) - you stay close to the leader.

I know that folks who are not familiar with the no anchor drift diving style in this area, you are not free to dawdle behind. As the boat follows the groups' main cluster of bubbles. Not the straggler who falls behind.

If there was no current, I would not mind being his buddy. I like to poke around, shine my lights in the crevices, etc. But in current, and the drifting dive boat overhead - the safest position is with the group. And that means close to the DM.

Its pretty hard to dawdle in a drift dive, don't you think?

But the second dive did not. Of course, I feel funny about asking my buddy with hundreds of dive what his gauge is reading. Fortunately, the DM checked, and my buddy was low on air. We had to do a mandatory safety stop, and my buddy ran out of air. He had to share the octo with the DM.

So did he dawdle or not? If someone falls behind how do they end up sharing air with the DM?

I really don't mean to be this hard on you - but you are really railing on entire groups of people - photogs and Americans in general.

 

[MXGratefulDiver]

My question is, how much responsibility should one have for their instabuddy, especially if he or she is a photographer?

I'm going to take this back to the original question for a moment.

Your responsibility to your dive buddy ... whether they are an instabuddy, a photographer, or not ... includes the following:

- Discuss and agree to a dive plan.
- Stick to the plan
- Begin and end the dive together
- Maintain contact and communication with each other during the dive
- Dive within the limits of your training and experience
- Provide assistance, if needed, during the dive

The responsibilities above should only be disregarded under the following circumstances:

- Your buddy decides, without your consent, to disregard the dive plan
- Your buddy is diving in a manner that is irresponsible or beyond your ability and/or training
- Your buddy does something that could place you in an unsafe situation (i.e. ascending too quickly)

If any of the above take place, you should attempt to communicate your concerns to your dive buddy, remedy the situation, and failing that, abort the dive.

The above responsibility and limitations should have nothing to do with either your prior experience with this dive buddy or their preferred style of diving. If those are a concern they should be discussed prior to the dive, and if you are in any way uncomfortable with the responses of the other diver then it is YOUR responsibility to decide whether or not to dive with this person. The most prudent decision is usually to either find another dive buddy or not do the dive.

Your safety and comfort level are not the responsibility of someone else ... you own them, and only you can decide what to do with them.

You had other options. Since you were following a dive guide, you could ... and should ... have expressed the same concerns you have here to your dive guide and requested other arrangements. Those arrangements could have included either joining one of the other buddy teams, finding a different buddy, or simply agreeing to stick close to the dive guide.

Never ... NEVER ... get in the water with someone you're uncomfortable diving with. Doing so is not their mistake ... it's yours.

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

 

[diverrex]

I very seldom go on a dive with an instabuddy, for lots of reasons I much prefer diving with someone well known to me. But on occassion when I've really wanted to dive a particular day and none of my regular known buddies is available I have done so with an instabuddy. On those days I realize that the dives may not go the way I'd prefer- too short, inattentive buddy, too clingy a buddy, swims too fast, swims too slow, boring topside buddy, etc. etc. I figure that's simply the price you pay for not bringing your buddy that day. You really don't think all blind dates are going to be great do you?

 

[stevetim]

If someone lies to you just to get on a boat, all responsibility on your part should be directed at yourself and making sure YOU get to the surface alive because he may actually do something stupid like grab your primary out of your mouth when he tries to take a breath and gets NOTHING after running out of air.

 

[Acanthurus]

Unfortunately Pine Nut you got hooked up with a slob.

How does "an older overweight American" translate into a slob?

 

[MXGratefulDiver]

If someone lies to you just to get on a boat, all responsibility on your part should be directed at yourself and making sure YOU get to the surface alive because he may actually do something stupid like grab your primary out of your mouth when he tries to take a breath and gets NOTHING after running out of air.

Why let it get to that point?

If you're diving with someone who's skills you're unsure of, it behooves you to pay MORE attention to that person ... not less. If you notice they're behaving erratically or getting low on air, thumb the dive.

Assuming that a diver is going to go postal on you is an irrational response ... and it's an almost completely preventable outcome if you pay attention and follow your training.

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

 

[MXGratefulDiver]

How many people are trained in deploying an SMB at depth? I would dare say none, even after achieving DM or instructor status. I do not think it is an agency requirement at OW, AOW, DM or even higher levels.

All of my AOW students are taught how to deploy an SMB at depth, and how to ascend and make safety stops while using it as a guideline to the surface. If you are going to be drift-diving, it's a really good idea to acquire those skills ...

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

 

[trigfunctions]

Sounds like you had a pretty sh--ty buddy.

Sounds like your buddy did too.

I disagree with your second statement. PineNut said
"I was upfront on if he is not keeping up and chose to take pictures; I will simply be buddying up to the divemaster. I was not going to be a spare-air tank for a photographer."

It was the insta-buddy who chose to linger behind and take pictures, knowing what the consequences would be. It was also the insta-buddy who lied about his experience level. As far as I can tell, PineNut planned his dive and dove his plan, just like he is supposed to.

PineNut - can I ask, what was the time and depth profile for the dives that day?

 

[SailNaked]

Im not sure I can contribute much after 36 posts, however as a former US Marine I do have an opinion on what a buddy is and what your duty is.

Your duty is to stay with your buddy.....


if he is a moron, if he is fat, if he is an American, if he is a photographer,if he is a hoover... your duty is to stay with your buddy no excuse, no option. unless you reasonably expect you are about to die and you can not save your buddy also!!!!!!


what sort of BS plan is "i'll stay with you unless _______ then im with the DM."

Dive alone if that is your plan, at least your buddy and the DM will know it.

as a foot note, the DMs on guided tours are not your Buddy, they are barely there to assist in your body recovery when you F"up.

 

[SkimFisher]

oh, this is getting good now...

One thing my instructor has emphasized is to watch and observe the students/divers. When working with a certified diver student, doing a specialty course for instance, if they quickly and correctly set up their gear, they are going to tend to be solid students. If they fumble around a lot, if they stall, or if they talk a big game or boast, you need to keep an eye on them. Sure enough I can't think of a student yet where that hasn't been true. Call it diving profiling.

I do the same thing. If you pay attention to how someone acts and talks during the pre-dive it generally gives a very good indication of what kind of buddy they are going to be.

I very seldom go on a dive with an instabuddy, for lots of reasons I much prefer diving with someone well known to me. But on occassion when I've really wanted to dive a particular day and none of my regular known buddies is available I have done so with an instabuddy. On those days I realize that the dives may not go the way I'd prefer- too short, inattentive buddy, too clingy a buddy, swims too fast, swims too slow, boring topside buddy, etc. etc. I figure that's simply the price you pay for not bringing your buddy that day. You really don't think all blind dates are going to be great do you?

That's really the key. I've been lucky with most of the people I've insta-buddied with. If you want to enjoy a dive - bring a buddy you're familiar with. Otherwise be prepared to adjust accordingly. Don't just leave your buddy behind. You should never put yourself in harms way, but we do have a responsibility to each other.