How often do you check up on your buddy during a dive?

[jlcnuke]

I agree in general, but I believe the range of variability over which you can make adjustments to take into account experience, vis, etc., and still function as a buddy is smaller than you do. I base my understanding on the skills we were taught, and at the top of that list is how to handle an OOA situation. I think we're on the same page there. An OOA diver in a pair who are strictly relying on the buddy system needs to be able to obtain air from his buddy before he resorts to something else. That means you need to know each other's location well enough that you can reach them in time. So, while I agree there is a range in terms of both distance and precision (of knowing their location), I believe it's a smaller range than you suggest.

I don't know where you got the "3 minutes" and "30 feet" estimates, but I find it hard to believe those numbers hold true in many real-world scenarios. Sure, if someone intentionally holds his breath, he can go for quite a while. But what if he's happily swimming along, thinking about something other than his breathing, exhales, goes to take the next breath, and gets nothing--stuck with empty-ish lungs? Can he really be expected to swim 3 minutes or 30 feet? Even if he manages to do that, will he be calm enough to not jeopardize the air-sharing procedure when the two buddies meet? I have experienced having an OOA buddy (and being OOA myself) more than once--all during training--and I don't think those numbers are realistic. A very experienced diver might be able to remain cool, even with empty lungs, for a few seconds longer than an average diver, but I believe the range of variability is just a matter of seconds. I guess we disagree. A first on SB.

Just to explain where I made up the numbers from:
I learned the 'rule of threes' when I was younger. The average person can go three minutes without air, 3 days without food, and 3 weeks without water. I don't doubt that panic will impact how long someone 'thinks' they can go without air, but we can go a lot longer than the natural reflex to breath suggests. As for the 30 ft, I just made it up as I believe that's pretty close to the length that PADI suggests you do the CESA for in an OW class (might be a bit more or a bit less, but 30 ft is pretty close I'm sure. Seems if they think you can practice being without air for 30 ft, an OOA diver should be able to go that far.

Nothing wrong with disagree about things on the internet. I have my opinions, but I don't claim them to be truths or valid for everyone.

 

[happy-diver]

you gotta understand the significant difference between swimming sideways and up

 

[drrich2]

But what if he's happily swimming along, thinking about something other than his breathing, exhales, goes to take the next breath, and gets nothing--stuck with empty-ish lungs?

That's likely. In basic OW training I ran out of air at depth (so when we did the CESA, it was kinda real!). Once mulling around in the very shallows doing a 'rubble crawl' at the end of a dive in Bonaire, basically did the same thing (note: this was addressed by standing up, at which point my head stuck right up out of the water). The relevant point is, by the time I noticed resistance to breathing to let know I was about out, I was not getting another good lung-full of air to tide me over while I decided what to do. The moral of the story...watch your pressure readings!

Richard.

 

[jlcnuke]

you gotta understand the significant difference between swimming sideways and up

I understand both the difference both from a physics standpoint as well as physiological. The most significant difference in such a relatively short distance, however, is psychological.

 

[Foothills]

My "buddy" protocols vary based on the dive plan and buddy. If I am leading the dive and running the compass, and diving with my usual dive buddies (experienced, used to diving with each other, well trained & skilled) then I tend not to check very often. In that case it is explicitly the responsibility of the others to stay on my tail. They use lights (poor visibility in local water bodies mean lights can often be used to signal even at noon) to let me know that they are still on my 4 or 8. When I am trying to cover several hundred meters of distance across featureless mud flats by compass navigation I need to focus on the compass only.

With less experienced buddies (e.g. my son) or buddies I have little experience diving with, I flank them (if leading) or (preferably) hang on their 4 or 8 when following a guide (so I can shepherd them if need be). This way they are always in my field of view. When teaching, the "dive order" will vary based on the skills to be executed and the dive conditions. I prefer to have students in my field of view at all times, but if necessary I will have them follow me.

 

[tbone1004]

As title says, how often do you check up on your buddy during a dive?
If you're leading the dive and your buddy is behind you, how often would you flash the OK sign back to your buddy to check if he's alright?

Had a pretty heated discussion about this today, so many divers (instabuddies, anyone?) dive solely thinking about themselves and not really caring about the fact that you're a team.

not going to read this whole thread, but here's my answer
to your first question, nearly constantly
to your second question, only if I suspect something is wrong, though me in front should only be penetration diving which is a different animal.

I don't believe in excessive signalling because it distracts you from everything else. If you listen to their breathing patterns if on OC, or in your second question look at their light movement, you shouldn't need to ask if they're OK unless something looks or sounds weird. It has nothing to do with being in a team or not, and everything to do with how good you are as a dive buddy. If you're good and observant, you don't need to ask them all the time and all it does is distract and annoy people.

I recommend you listen to this podcast and read the blog also linked. Brando is a retired GUE instructor, former commercial diver and combat medic, and James is one of the founding members of UTD. I.e. both of them are VERY well versed in team diving, DIR diving instruction, etc. Their podcast is legit, and entertaining, and I highly recommend that everyone reading this post check them out.
Episode 28 - Photography Survey Results Show
Thoughts on 28- Passive Communication
Just because I am using what they call passive communication, doesn't mean I am not checking on my buddy. I'm 99% sure that @victorzamora and @The Chairman would drown me if I actually made them flash OK signs at me every couple of minutes while we were diving. I don't fault new divers for being overly cautious, but as you get more experienced, the quantity of active communication is actively reduced and the quality of passive communication is increased. Victor and I almost never talk to each other during the dive *with the exception of during deco when various obscenities usually regarding boredom, hunger, or cold are going back and forth*, though he is prone to singing while we are diving, which is much worse on CCR since it's easier to hear.... Thankfully he dives a Magnus which is quite loud so I can't hear it while on the trigger. We flash OK right after dropping off or picking up bottles/scooters/etc. just to make sure the other is ready to go, same at the start of the dive, or when ready to change depth on a deco stop, but other than that, unless we are trying to clarify something like a jump, essentially all of our communication is passive. If I'm with a new diver and they are constantly asking me if I'm ok, and I know I'm ok, then it usually means THEY are not ok and are acting nervous. Not cool

 

[lermontov]

Just to explain where I made up the numbers from:
The average person can go three minutes without air, 3 days without food, and 3 weeks without water. .

err no youve got that mixed up 3days without water

 

[jlcnuke]

err no youve got that mixed up 3days without water

I knew as soon as I typed it that I had something wrong lol. Thanks.

 

[TMHeimer]

Some good recent posts about proper distances from each other. I lean toward agreeing with the shorter distance folks.
Maybe splitting hairs, but there may be some confusion regarding what the OP meant by "checking up". Are we all talking about a quick glance (every 10 secs. in my case) at a buddy or some signaling--OK? Air check?, etc. I only do the latter once in a while--like checking air when we near a turn point.

 

[jlcnuke]

Some good recent posts about proper distances from each other. I lean toward agreeing with the shorter distance folks.
Maybe splitting hairs, but there may be some confusion regarding what the OP meant by "checking up". Are we all talking about a quick glance (every 10 secs. in my case) at a buddy or some signaling--OK? Air check?, etc. I only do the latter once in a while--like checking air when we near a turn point.

Likely a lot of variation on that. Imo, I'm not "checking on" my buddy if some direct communication between us isn't involved. I glance at the reef looking for fish/sharks/turtles/etc and happen to notice my buddy is still nearby at the 5 o'çlock direction and isn't flailing at me etc, doesn't count as "checking on my buddy" to me.