A call to PADI certified divers and poll about 2001 MSD changes.

[matt_unique]

Many have read a previous thread about the value of the PADI MSD certification. (In fact there were more than 2600 views). I learned as a result of these threads that PADI essentially reduced the diving requirements to qualify for the PADI MSD. As of 2001, non-diving certifications can apply to the requisite 5 specialties for the MSD certification. Considering what the MSD meant and means to me, I ask my fellow PADI certified divers to submit constructive feedback to PADI about this change. I am disappointed that PADI has diminished the value and perceived value of my MSD certification as a result of this change.

Thanks

Matt

 

[matt_unique]

Many have read a previous thread about the value of the PADI MSD certification. (In fact there were more than 2600 views). I learned as a result of these threads that PADI essentially reduced the diving requirements to qualify for the PADI MSD. As of 2001, non-diving certifications can apply to the requisite 5 specialties for the MSD certification. Considering what the MSD meant and means to me, I ask my fellow PADI certified divers to submit constructive feedback to PADI about this change. I am disappointed that PADI has diminished the value and perceived value of my MSD certification as a result of this change.

Thanks

Matt

The following contact appears to be responsible for forwarding training and quality related questions to reps within PADI. I would encourage PADI certified divers and especially MSD's to send a constructive note about your feelings on the issue.

Thanks

--Matt

>>Thank you for your email to the Training and Quality Management. An
Educational Consultant will get back to you as soon as possible.

Regards,
Sabrina Fiorella Larson
Coordinator, Training & Quality Management
Coordinatrice, Formazione e Gestione della Qualita'
Coordinatrice, Entrainement et Gestion de la Qualite'
email: sabrinal@padi.com <<

 

[Scottri]

I don't know, I never really saw much value to the MSD rating anyway. I never put any stock in a Master Diver rating from any agency and PADI's isn't based on experience as much as specialties. I like the SSI approach better. I am a PADI DM so I'm not biased either way. 5 Specialites is pretty subjective, I could take Night, Deep, Nav, boat diving and something stupid like altitude diving and achieve that rating. They should require real education like Night, Deep, Navigation, Wreck and Nitrox. My point being that the classes required should require more advanced diving theory and technique and not easy run of the mill stuff.


Scott

 

[Walter]

While they may allow non diving certs to apply to the 5 specialties required, at least the put in a minimum number of dives. Prior to that change, you could get a PADI MSD cert with surprisingly few dives. Does it matter if a diver with 50+ dives takes a non diving cert or a boat cert or a nav cert or a buoyancy cert or a night cert? Face it, there are a bunch of diving certs that anyone with an advanced cert should have already mastered. Unless PADI requires those 5 certs to be specific classes with substance, it really doesn't matter if they allow non diving certs to count toward MSD. I do see the new 50 dive requirement as a positive step in the right direction to making the MSD cert mean something. They have a long way to go, but it's a start. I hope they'll take the next step.

 

[ScubaJewel]

It's my feeling that the MSD rating grew out of a marketing plan that gets students to pay additional $ to PADI and and/or an Instructor for essentially nothing.

If that wasn't the case then It's my feeling that the MSD level of Certification should simply be given Free of charge (except maybe the Pic card fee) to every diver that holds sufficient certifications to hold it.

Through our dive club and other contacts I know dozens of divers who hold a sufficient number of specialty certs to qualify for the MSD but the only divers I know that actually hold that rating are the ones who like to "collect" certification cards.

I ask why pay the $ for the card when it really prooves nothing and has no meaning?

Julie

 

[FreeFloat]

My mistake folks, I voted in the poll even though I am not PADI trained. I didn't realize this was set up to pick the brains of only PADI poeple....

I was following the other thread for a while, which is why this one piqued my interest...

 

[matt_unique]

We discussed the value of MSD/PADI/other agencies etc. in great detail with two other threads. My intent for this thread is to ask PADI divers to weigh in on the issue of the MSD cert requirements specifically.

I had correspondence with a PADI Training and Quality rep who said "we at PADI feel the value of the MSD is not diminished with the change in requirements". I wanted to encourage PADI divers to provide real data to PADI by way of feedback as to whether their perception is correct or incorrect.

I would say clearly from my experience in the previous MSD threads their perception of value is quite incorrect.

Thanks for the help.

--Matt

 

[simbrooks]

Being within your target audience, as a PADI OW "trained" diver - if you can call it training! The simple answer is that i think the non-diving certs being used for the MSD cert is a joke, the 50 dives can mean something (they can be easily achieved without varying experiences in the same environment in very little time), but may also mean very little, the pre-req's of this card are reasonable (same as SSI and SDI i believe), but that is all they are and the card is about. The card meant very little before this change, it means just as little now - so in fact the value has not dimished and the PADI PR person (arent they all PR materials in PADI courses?) is correct.

I also dont hold much in the AOW program, but no doubt will require it in the future for some dive boats. I do value the speciality certs and have a list of the ones i want to achieve to increase my skills and knowledge of this sport, but apart from the NAUI MSD course (where you actually dive to gain the cert) i really cant see any point in the card for the sake of carrying plastic - talking of which, how many of you have more than 1 creditcard?? I only have one and dont see the value of more than one, similarly in diving, the specialities can mean a little something themselves, but the MSD card is redundant, it just says you have 5 specialities and have done a bit of diving since you were OW certified. Within the next two months i will have done at least 2/3 of the dives required for the MSD, have an AOW (probably PADI, but thru a good instructor, GDI from the board) and have dived a few times at a modest depth (70-80ft plus the deep for AOW), over wrecks, drifting reefs, in caverns/simple caves, very low viz, moderately cold (for FL 60F), some of these were with DM's and organised trips, some were with members here, some will be further instruction and others are just with my GF/buddy. By the time i reach 50 dives and 5 specialities (like i said with cash not a hard thing to do) i would not even bother to apply for this extra card and certainly would not consider myself a master or even advanced diver, but also not a resort diver!!

 

[LUBOLD8431]

"we at PADI feel the value of the MSD is not diminished with the change in requirements".

I believe this statement is true. Many people already feel that the MSD rating means nothing. You cant get any lower than that...

 

[Ron Brandt]

While they may allow non diving certs to apply to the 5 specialties required, at least the put in a minimum number of dives. Prior to that change, you could get a PADI MSD cert with surprisingly few dives. Does it matter if a diver with 50+ dives takes a non diving cert or a boat cert or a nav cert or a buoyancy cert or a night cert? Face it, there are a bunch of diving certs that anyone with an advanced cert should have already mastered. Unless PADI requires those 5 certs to be specific classes with substance, it really doesn't matter if they allow non diving certs to count toward MSD. I do see the new 50 dive requirement as a positive step in the right direction to making the MSD cert mean something. They have a long way to go, but it's a start. I hope they'll take the next step.

I agree with Walter.As an instructor I do not encourage non diving related certifications.

Ron