Thank you everyone for the advice. While a 77% is lower than I or my fiancee' got on our tests, it's still above the passing level and I decided to focus on that. We gave him a lot of positive reinforcement and quizzes, and he started watching the dvd's over again of his own volition. Today will show what good this has actually done as I'm taking them in for a short recap of what they learned and their first day of pool dives. I think that probably the most important thing to keep in mind at this level is what he's really earning by taking this course is a license to learn from more experienced divers for the rest of his life - or as long as he likes.
Advice for my younger brother
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BabyDuck
Contributor
i don't have a child that old, and i'm not an instructor, so bring your grain of salt.
i would have a word with the instructor about what you're seeing and your worries that he's not taking it seriously. make him/her aware. i doubt s/he'd miss it anyway, but perk up his/her antennae.
then i would have the same word with the instructor *while your brother is standing there* - 'hi, instructor. i'd like a minute. i want you and brother to know i have reservations about how serious he is about scuba, and i want you both to know up front that i don't want him to pass unless he shows you that he is willing to learn and trying to do a good job and showing you the skills and a good attitude. if he's not showing you these things, let me know and we'll stop trying now and try again in a year or two. brother, do you understand? not as punishment, but because it is important.'
i would have a word with the instructor about what you're seeing and your worries that he's not taking it seriously. make him/her aware. i doubt s/he'd miss it anyway, but perk up his/her antennae.
then i would have the same word with the instructor *while your brother is standing there* - 'hi, instructor. i'd like a minute. i want you and brother to know i have reservations about how serious he is about scuba, and i want you both to know up front that i don't want him to pass unless he shows you that he is willing to learn and trying to do a good job and showing you the skills and a good attitude. if he's not showing you these things, let me know and we'll stop trying now and try again in a year or two. brother, do you understand? not as punishment, but because it is important.'
I've been taking a hiatus from teaching, so I'm not 100% up on the current state of the SSI online course. But when I was teaching, the SSI online course, the students took the final exam at the store. I found that students that took my regular class passed the exam with an average score of about 94%. Students that took the online course usually failed the exam the first time. And after some coaching, would pass with an average of about 84%. (Minimum passing score for SSI is 80%) When I had a class of online students, I would usually try to schedule 1 day of review. But most of them weren't interested in spending any time in class. At least, not until they failed the exam.
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Crush
Contributor
Your brother's learning the material (or not) differs a bit (don't take this out of context, SB fanatics) from his being able to be a good diver. For example, a knowledge of theoretical tissue compartments will not make him better buddy. His knowledge of the material will be assessed by the instructor who should not/must not pass him if his knowledge and skills are inadequate.
I have a tip regarding his buddy skills - for the first several dives after OW don't partner him with your fiance. Your brother is familiar with you and your fiance so he is likely as young men are wont to treat you casually and perhaps carelessly. Partner him with a figure of respect and someone with whom he is unfamiliar, and make sure that said authority figure clearly explains his buddy expectations of your brother prior to the dive. Get this authority figure to whip him into shape in the first few dives before poor habits set in.
I have a tip regarding his buddy skills - for the first several dives after OW don't partner him with your fiance. Your brother is familiar with you and your fiance so he is likely as young men are wont to treat you casually and perhaps carelessly. Partner him with a figure of respect and someone with whom he is unfamiliar, and make sure that said authority figure clearly explains his buddy expectations of your brother prior to the dive. Get this authority figure to whip him into shape in the first few dives before poor habits set in.
Dive the World
Contributor
you want a 13 year old to be serious about something? O Boy!
People learn in different ways - some learn by reading, some by hearing, some by doing. Some learn a lot and don't do well on test.
If he doubt his retention go through some questions - ask him, why this? why that? what happens if...?
That would give you a better understanding of where he is and also give him perspective of the serious nature of diving.
Good Luck.
People learn in different ways - some learn by reading, some by hearing, some by doing. Some learn a lot and don't do well on test.
If he doubt his retention go through some questions - ask him, why this? why that? what happens if...?
That would give you a better understanding of where he is and also give him perspective of the serious nature of diving.
Good Luck.
Bob DBF
Contributor
The most important thing is for your brother to understand is that he has to be an adult while diving because he will be responsible for his buddy's life. I had these conversations with my daughter and made sure she was up for the responsibility before I taught her about guns, boat handling and driving (she was not interested in SCUBA untill later). Most of the time she was a regular kid, but in an "adult" situation she put her game face on and aquitted herself better than a number of adults I've known.
Malpaso and Crush are on point, because of the importance of the task you need to make an objective evaluation of your brothers skills and maturity for the task. If he isn't ready now, mabe next year. Personally, I've found kids can step up to a challange if they arn't bulls*****d or coddled. Of course you will have to treat him like an adult if he acts like one.
Bob
-----------------------------------------
I may be old, but Im not dead yet.
I have had a few students, did well in the class room, pool and ocean. Failed written. Gave the written test orally. Passed with fly colors. Oh,
had him read the questions to me. He had a major problem of reading. Informed his parents, he concentrated his 8 to 12 on reading. Now going through
college and can read now.
had him read the questions to me. He had a major problem of reading. Informed his parents, he concentrated his 8 to 12 on reading. Now going through
college and can read now.
C P
Contributor
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I've had some younger students who had trouble with the academics because they did not really comprehend the words used in material well enough until we sat down and discussed it in a manner they understood. Also when they finally get into the water what they learned in the knowledge review sessions begins to really make sense. The post above about the driver's test and McDonald's really hit home. While I recognize some advantages with the on-line studying, I still prefer to have instructor/student interaction for the knowledge reviews. Before passing judgement see how the confined water sessions go, this may lead to some valuable conversations about the material afterwards.
I think providing positive reinforcement was the best thing you could do. I also believe the more time his big brother spends with him the more likely he is to do well(since he wanted to be a diver like you
.. I have taught many kids but only a couple that have completed on-line academics, they all did fine, Just be supportive and firm ... Please keep us updated on how your little brother does....
Cheers,
Roger
My apologies in advance for not keeping this thread updated. When my instructor found that I had come to Scubaboard looking for advice he expressed some very negative feelings about my doing so. I don't know if it is a similar experience for most new divers, but I looked up to this instructor as sort of a diving mentor so I took his comments as valid. At the time I also had very low self esteem, so I followed his advice and moved away from any scuba forums and websites.
In short, my brother did not pass his first pool session, and I honestly don't know if he will ever attempt diving again.
I was, and still am, interested in being a Scuba Instructor, so when I went to the pool session with my brother and my wife I didn't mind being asked to help verify equipment was set up correctly, etc. and thought it was a great opportunity to see the learning process from the outside. It seemed like my brother was struggling with some things, but I wasn't too worried about it. It was the first pool session after all and, due to the comments on here about internet students, I expected that he would take extra time to thoroughly understand everything.
It came as a surprise to me when, about half way through, the instructor ordered me to leave the pool room for the remainder of the lesson. According to my wife, after I left the instructor took my brother aside and had a whispered conversation with him. When they met me at the car my brother was crying and he continued to cry for the entire drive home. He has never spoken about it again. When asked he says that he can't remember what was said. All he knows is that he failed. I received no information from the instructor other than it was his belief that my brother only wanted to dive because I do.
That night when I dropped him off at home I told him that I am proud of him for even trying. It's obvious to me now that he was just a kid in way over his head, but I will always be proud of him for trying. If you are wondering, my wife did manage to pass all of the pool sessions and the open water dives, earning her open water certification. Strangely, while reviewing our experiences it seems as though she went through an almost entirely different, very abbreviated course.
In short, my brother did not pass his first pool session, and I honestly don't know if he will ever attempt diving again.
I was, and still am, interested in being a Scuba Instructor, so when I went to the pool session with my brother and my wife I didn't mind being asked to help verify equipment was set up correctly, etc. and thought it was a great opportunity to see the learning process from the outside. It seemed like my brother was struggling with some things, but I wasn't too worried about it. It was the first pool session after all and, due to the comments on here about internet students, I expected that he would take extra time to thoroughly understand everything.
It came as a surprise to me when, about half way through, the instructor ordered me to leave the pool room for the remainder of the lesson. According to my wife, after I left the instructor took my brother aside and had a whispered conversation with him. When they met me at the car my brother was crying and he continued to cry for the entire drive home. He has never spoken about it again. When asked he says that he can't remember what was said. All he knows is that he failed. I received no information from the instructor other than it was his belief that my brother only wanted to dive because I do.
That night when I dropped him off at home I told him that I am proud of him for even trying. It's obvious to me now that he was just a kid in way over his head, but I will always be proud of him for trying. If you are wondering, my wife did manage to pass all of the pool sessions and the open water dives, earning her open water certification. Strangely, while reviewing our experiences it seems as though she went through an almost entirely different, very abbreviated course.
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