Appropriate???

[seaducer]

In general I would agree with you seaducer, but the dive in question was at a resort where "resort certifications" and new PADI certifications abound. Part of the sales pitch is safe diving under the watchful eye of experienced DM's. Thus my second issue of the guide multi-tasking with at least one newbie in the group. As a lot of new/occasional divers do use resorts of this nature, I don't think they should be excluded from consideration.

If they advertised DMs specifically for mentoring new divers, and that is what was paid for, then that is what you should have received. Then I would agree the speargun should be left on the boat. The float is their job though, can't leave that behind.

OTOH this would be outside the normal operating procedures. It is quite likely that you will see those lines advertised but to be honest most DMs treat all divers as if they know what they are doing. That includes divers on their post OW class dive (who for the most part are some of the safest divers there are...

 

[Insta-Gator]

I am not trying to be confrontational or start another derailed thread, however if you have an OW card from a recognized agency, you paid for training to make you capable of diving without supervision.

Please do not expect the DMs to be there specifically to watch over you and keep you safe, that is not what they are doing. If you feel you still need professional supervision, hire a DM to dive with just you and your buddy.

Is there a definition from any of the certification agency's as to what the DM role is? Seems to me there's an awful lot of training (time & expense) for this person to become a certified DM. DM, Dive Master, not dive buddy, not dive guide, not baby sitter... Dive Master...Master of the Dive, person in charge, person responsible for the successful conduct of the dive (including the safety of the group, in my opinion.) So if what I'm reading is all you experienced divers want to be left alone to do your thing...let's just hope these people with DM certifications don't expect any type for tip, gratuity or other form of appreciation for their time spent spear fishing.

 

[tbone1004]

we tip because they do dive briefing before hand and tell us what's going on as far as conditions and what to expect. We tip them for tying the boat in, because that's not the easiest thing in the world and isn't my idea of fun...
Now, up here, the DM's CAN'T baby sit the dive. They'll blow NDL's before most divers can get in the water.. They act more as ship mates which is fine by me. In the tropics where they don't have to tie in necessarily, and you're on a reef it's nice to have them point stuff out, but I still maintain that you shouldn't need a Dive Master to babysit you and make sure you don't blow your NDL's, suck your gas like a Hoover, and not bounce up and down into the reef. If you can't do all three of those on your own, get out of the ocean, back in a pool and learn how to dive. You aren't a safe independent diver, and you are doing a "trust me" dive. With an instructor that may be fine, and at a resort where they are doing the resort certs, I think the instructor should be there to help you.
"The program is designed to train experienced and knowledgeable divers to organize and conduct enjoyable open water dives for certified divers."-Per NAUI's leadership manual. If you can't do the three things mentioned above you shouldn't be certified and by having to babysit those divers, then the dive is not enjoyable for everyone else. Bring an instructor, that's what they're for.

 

[seaducer]

Is there a definition from any of the certification agency's as to what the DM role is? Seems to me there's an awful lot of training (time & expense) for this person to become a certified DM. DM, Dive Master, not dive buddy, not dive guide, not baby sitter... Dive Master...Master of the Dive, person in charge, person responsible for the successful conduct of the dive (including the safety of the group, in my opinion.) So if what I'm reading is all you experienced divers want to be left alone to do your thing...let's just hope these people with DM certifications don't expect any type for tip, gratuity or other form of appreciation for their time spent spear fishing.

Dive masters have many roles, depending on what they are doing.

If they are supervising students or Discover Scuba clients they should be managing the dive including buoyancy, gas management and safety.

If they are leading certified divers they are going to be briefing the dive, carrying the float on a drift, navigating and pointing out stuff. Safety concerns are now the responsibility of the individual divers who are trained to manage their own dive, including ending their dive if things are not going well. We are talking about adults...right?

One of the roles of a DM is to safeguard the environment they are diving in. In this case spearing a feral species is absolutely appropriate.

Bottom line is nobody is more responsible for your safety than you are. Its your life after all, and hopefully you are the best person to look after it. If not...well no one ever said life was fair. People make poor decisions all the time and suffer the consequences.