Are you still imperial?

[Nudi]

...but I have a hunch Walter is not going to agree that metric is safer.

I'm not saying metric is safer than imperial (although I could make a good argument for that). I'm saying standardization is safer, and metric is more sensible than imperial to be the standard. But now I'm just picking nits.

I definitely don't think that the diving industry will change unless the whole country has changed.

I think you might be right, but I hope you're wrong because that'll definitely take a while. It's kind of a chicken and egg problem. Gotta start somewhere. I think we agree that it needs to happen. I'm just less patient about it.

 

[DiverBuoy]

I want to adopt metric personally, but my biggest concern is that its smaller values represent larger values in depth. Like learning a language at first you translate everything you've only mastered it once you dream it, think it, no longer have to convert it.

The consequences of a miscalculation going from imperial to metric is very severe. If your brain momentarily lapses thinking 30 meters was instead 30 feet (vs 100ft), for example. Really, I think I would have adopted it already if it so happened that there were for example 2 meters per foot, so 200 meters represented 100 feet. Of course its water under the bridge but I think this is part of the reservation. If it was the other way around even if you screw up, you're on the conservative side. But that just isn't the case.

When it isn't your native system you worry about brain lapse in a possible heavy task load or emergency situation - where your powers of translation fail you.

 

[KeyLargoBrent]

PADI manuals have included both imperial and metric units, exposing readers to both systems simultaneously (eg. 100 feet/30 meters). Students and Instructors can utilize either system, or both systems simultaneously.

I personally like teaching with the metric system (simple), but most analogue guages sold here in the U.S. are still imperial. Dives can be made safely with either system, or both. Any confusion should be sorted out during pre-dive planning.

I deliver dive briefings using both systems when referring to depth and tank pressure. As for temperature... I'm still stuck in farenheit... anyone know of a short cut for conversion?

 

[Walter]

Neither system is "safer." They do exactly the same thing.

Some computers allow you to choose which system you'll use (sorry, I don't remember which ones).

Converting from one to the other is where problems arise. Why convert? Use which ever system you have instruments for and stay within that system. Get a themometer that reads in both and you don't need to convert.

Having preached on avoiding conversion, there is a short cut that works if you don't need precision. Memorize a temperature you use often for example 25 C = 77°F. Every 5 degrees C is 9 degrees F. Better to get another themometer. Or you can use {(C*9)/5}+32=F or {(F-32)*5}/9=C.

 

[DiverBuoy]

Walter once bubbled...
Converting from one to the other is where problems arise. Why convert? Use which ever system you have instruments for and stay within that system. Get a themometer that reads in both and you don't need to convert.

Walter my complaint has got nothing to do with changing the display on your instrument. Of course that is easily done. Why convert? Because for now I've memorized dozens of significances underwater - events, objects, cautions, warnings, and points of interest - all embedded in my memory at specific depths measured imperially in feet.

Now I would have to relearn what the depth in meters is for each of these. That's called conversion. Like I illustrated regarding language, while your mental powers are in tune you can quickly do the translation or in this case the math. Keep in mind all of this conversion is only until you settle into measuring in meters - every time without thought, that is until it becomes second nature. And your mind no longer works in feet.

No in fact Walter flipping the display on the gauge is not ALL THERE IS TO IT. If only you were asking me to adopt this change in a non-hazardous environment I would likely leap to the cause.

 

[Arnaud]

Diverbuoy, you have a very good point about conversion and your environment, especially in a stressful situation.

I'm sure that a lot of travelers find themselves renting their gear and are faced with using metric instruments outside the US. I'm also sure that this can cause confusion and can become dangerous if they don't pay proper attention. Come to think of it, I wonder if this doesn't explain the story of that inexperienced diver who dove at 170ft instead of 70 in the Caymans. This was posted a few weeks back.

So, in this situation, Nudi's point becomes especially valid.

 

[Walter]

DiverBuoy,

"If only you were asking me to adopt this change in a non-hazardous environment I would likely leap to the cause."

I'm not asking anyone to make any changes. I don't see a need to change. I'm quite happy to use feet, PSI and °F while diving. My point was conversion from one system to another is where problems take place. You merely pointed out another instance of conversions. It makes a stronger case to not switch, IMHO.

 

[Scubaroo]

Found this on the PADI website:

Why PADI Metric Diver?

Through the PADI Metric Diver Specialty course, you can learn the techniques and procedures for diving using metric instruments. Many countries outside of the US use the metric system of measurements, so if you're versed in the use of metric gauges and computers, the more countries you can dive in.

What do I need to start?

PADI Open Water Diver or Junior Open Water Diver certification (or qualifying certification from another organization)
Minimum age: 10 years old

What will I do?

As part of your PADI Metric Diver Specialty course, you'll learn about:

Metric diving planning, organization, procedures, techniques, problems and hazards
Proper Metric diving etiquette, including metric equipment storage and conduct
Common Metric terminology, such as meters and bar. Includes foreign spellings you may encounter such as "metres"
Specific and local Metric diving laws and ordinances
Overview of emergency and safety equipment needed to dive Metric

How long will it take?

Recommended Course Hours: 12
Minimum Open Water Training: two dives over one day
Where can I go from here?

The Metric Adventure Dive from the Adventures In Diving program may credit toward this Specialty course at the instructor's discretion. This Specialty course can also be one of the five Specialty certifications necessary for your PADI Master Scuba Diver certification.

If Metric diving sounds like the key to your next adventure, get in touch with your PADI Dive Center or Resort for more information

 

[Scuba]

At what point do we collectively decide to get out of our comfort zone and embrace a better system in terms of ease of understanding in comparing measurements?

When using the mind, easier to understand translates into faster to calculate and less error prone, therefore easier to use.

Do we all agree on this point?

Conversion concerns are real. But as the saying goes - No pain, no gain.

 

[DiverBuoy]

Clearly the change from imperial to metric is much broader than scuba diving (just ask NASA about a recent probe to Mars). But I think if the short term goal was to make this change just for diving ...

* Get DMs on boats to brief dive sites in metric - "On the starboard side of the boat at about 12 meters you'll find a cavern, on the port side the wall drops off to 50 meters so be very careful and pay close attention to your depth gauges, and avoiding going too deep. Our tanks are full at x Bar, when your tank gets down to ..."

* Get instructors to change the instrumentation for all student gear and teach the entire class in metric - "Now class what is the recreational limit for OW certifcation x Meters or y Meters?"

* Dive Operations - "This scuba toy can not be taken below x Meters"

* Manufacterers must get bold and sell instrumentation in Metric only - no longer offer imperial instrumentation

* PADI/NAUI/YMCA/SSI etc ... must provide texts with no translation to imperial. Must provide tests with no imperial sections. Must provide slates, RDPs, etc no imperial.

In the end what would it take just for scuba alone to adopt ... for the day when money doesn't matter <lol>