%#^*& Arrogant Ems

[TheAvatar]

Someone needs to tell a few paramedics and EMTs in the next county that just because they work on an ambulance and know how to use an ATV does not qualify them for swift water rescue... ESPECIALLY WHEN THEY DON'T KNOW HOW TO SWIM! They need to call the REAL swiftwater team when working in class III rapids because next time someone will get killed.

</rant>

Sorry about that.

 

[Whitelightnin]

Well, look on the bright side, If they get hurt, they can fix themselves up. They ARE trained in self administered CPR, aren't they???

 

[Gary D.]

Why would swimming be a requirement? If one is stupid enough to get into swift water without knowing what they are doing why should swimming be a requirement? Turnouts and swift water could be an interesting combo.

What did they do to insure our job security?

99.999% of our Fire and EMS are great. But we have rookie syndrome every now and then.

Last night I’m doing FST’s on a drunken monkey from a minor accident.

A med. crew shows up and a first shift EMT, fresh out of class, exits the truck like Snagglepuss exiting stage right. She heads right over to the two of us and freaks.

The crash box gets opened and some bandages come out and the drunken monkey goes to the ground. He then gets his eyes bandaged up at warp speed.

I asked her what she was doing. She says I’ll take care of his eye injuries, you go do what you need to and I’ll take care of him. I said I was doing just fine. She tells me that I’m not qualified to do what I was doing.

Had she not been so damn good-looking I may have said something else but I tell little miss eye candy she wasn’t qualified to do that. She comes back with yes I am. I ask, when did they start teaching that technique for FST’s?

She just looks at me like I don’t know what I’m talking about. I said. I have never seen a Horizontal Gaze Nystagmus test done like that before. Do you splint a leg when they can’t walk heal to toe?

She turned several shades of red when I told her I was checking his eye movement and not treating an eye enjury.

We all got a chuckle later. The drunk was a .20 four hours after his last drink.

Gary D.

 

[Snowbear]

Gotta give 'em points for enthusiasm, anyway....
Now it just needs to be channeled into some necessary training

 

[mstevens]

I went to medical school in Galveston. Little tiny island, great big medical school. The upshot is that practically NOTHING happened without a whole gaggle of doctors present. Somebody'd skin their knee on the seawall and there'd be two surgeons and a dermatologist right there. Typically, those of us in less emergent specialties would hang back so we didn't get in the way. On one occasion I was standing on a corner watching some guys I knew evaluate the participants in a multiple car/motorcycle crash on the seawall. Things were going pretty well until the EMT's arrived. They officiously shoo'ed everyone away and declared themselves in charge. One of the good samaritans pointed out that a particular victim needed to be sent to a different hospital than the closest (university) hospital for an MRI and got bawled out by an EMT for his trouble. The good samaritans were the director of the ED at the medical school (who knew the magnet was down), a professor of neurology, and a professor of surgery who specialized in multiple trauma. If I'd been the victim I sure would've been glad that EMT kept them from interfering with my care...

On another note, one of my professors (a psychiatrist) delivered a baby on the Bolivar ferry one night. She asked the deckhand what they did when there wasn't a doctor on-board. He scratched his head then said that in his 30 years on the ferry that had never happened.

 

[Snowbear]

I once stopped at a crash site where a motorbike rider had T-boned a sedan at close to 100mph. The dude (bike rider) was lying face down across the hood of the car. He had a pulse but was not breathing, so I enlisted the help of the cop who had been chasing the motorbike to get the guy rolled over. I had a kit in my car that included a BagValveMask (I don't do mouth-to-mouth :11.

A doctor from one of the less respected local hospitals (this was in California) stopped to help. He kept getting in the way trying to listen to lung sounds (he wanted to rule out a collapsed lung - why I don't know, he didn't have the knowledge or equipment to fix it). I finally told him, "He's not breathing.... you're not gonna get any lung sounds until we get this guy flipped over so I can bag him!" Thankfully the FD with medics on board showed up and kicked the doc out of the way

 

[crisis_12]

I do wish all public safety types could just get along. I know this is a forlorn hope since 14 years as a career paramedic in a combo career-vollie system, has led me to come to the conclusion that we are all cannibals.

This being said, one of the biggest problems in the biz is that every little subset of the equation seems to think they are always in the right and as a result are VERY territorial. Please know that I’ve been/am a PSD, rescue tech, truckie, and even the tactical medic for the local SRT. Everywhere I’ve been I hear the same complaint about those “%#^*& arrogant………” Invariably the very next day, I see the people doing the complaining do something so stupid that even a jaded burnout like me cringes. (e.g cops beating the hypoglycemic diabetic 70 year old woman unconscious; firefighters unable to figure out how to get the engine in pump gear; or even the paramedic forgetting to initiate CPR after tubing and shocking the patient.) If it weren’t so tragic it would truly be funny.

Since you want to bash the humps-what we call medics around here, for being stupid and arrogant (and yes, on prima facia I agree they were stupid) you best be prepared to take your lumps when you do something that you think you’re qualified for. And yes, even a hero like you will do something truly stupid if you stay in the service long enough. Just food for thought and a plea to maybe not air your dirty laundry where the civilians can see it.

 

[The Kraken]

TheAvatar . . .
Most people have NO CONCEPT how powerful moving water is.
In more years of paddling than I care to mention, I've had many experiences in extracting boaters from some pretty severe (iv/v) rapids.
If anyone out there is reading this thread, I'd just like to share one little, insignificant bit of paddling trivia . . .

Your average recreational canoe, when swamped and filled with water, weighs about 3500 pounds, which is more than most cars weigh. You don't want to be between a swamped canoe and a rock.

The speed and force of water is awesome, and in many cases quite deadly.

In the scenario you mention so many times the rescuers become the victims.

the K

 

[DaFireMedic]

As far as the incident goes, it may or may not have been arrogance. It was more likely a lack of training/knowledge about just how dangerous such an attempt really is.

As far as the general arrogance thing in EMS, certainly there is arrogance in some, just as there is arrogance in many on Scubaboard. But it is not the general rule, and and as in any field, you will have that percentage that is worse than others. We work very well with our surrounding agencies, and in general have respect for one another. The majority of them are nice people, and many are downright humble. But I can name a few people on all those agencies that would fit right into the category of being "always right" and are not afraid to tell you that.

It sounds like "crisis_12" has a system wide problem that has been allowed to build up over years. This seems to be more of a problem in larger agencies with long traditions, but can certainly happen in smaller agencies as well. But go unto other fields of work, and you'll find arrogance there as well. The owner of the closest LDS to my house is the reason that I won't go into his shop.

 

[TheAvatar]

Everywhere I’ve been I hear the same complaint about those “%#^*& arrogant………”

Since you want to bash the humps-what we call medics around here, for being stupid and arrogant (and yes, on prima facia I agree they were stupid) you best be prepared to take your lumps when you do something that you think you’re qualified for. And yes, even a hero like you will do something truly stupid if you stay in the service long enough. Just food for thought and a plea to maybe not air your dirty laundry where the civilians can see it.

Hmmm... except I am an EMT, I work for an EMS service... actually I work for the same EMS service as the people I called arrogant. That's where I earn my living (I don't get paid to be a PSD or a swift water rescuer). I'm not giving out service names. That's the reason I was so angry. It was my off day. I was fully expecting a swift water page to go pull my friends and coworkers out.