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Cave Ccr Student Dies At Blue Grotto Today

Discussion in 'Accidents & Incidents' started by The Chairman, Apr 15, 2016.

  1. kwinter

    kwinter Rebreather Pilot

    # of Dives: 500 - 999
    Location: South Jersey
    1,563
    757
    A lot of people seem to be interested in what might be possible to get away with, like staying on the loop in a complete visual blackout by hearing a solenoid click. And agencies might differ in their teaching of how to do blackout drills. But every CCR course I know of from every agency and every rebreather, from basic mod 1 air dil no deco to advanced trimix and cave has one mantra that is never disputed:
    ALWAYS KNOW YOUR PO2.
    It is the basic hallmark of CCR diving. So I am incredulous that there would be any agency or any instructor that thinks it is ok to "challenge" a student to maintain pO2 on the loop without being able to monitor it. The skill serves no useful purpose whatsoever.

    Open circuit bailout, open loop breathing, or even SCR might be appropriate real-life methods of dealing with this situation. Staying on CCR without being able to monitor pO2 violates the very essence of CCR training.
     
    whodunit68, shoredivr and rongoodman like this.
  2. MK1709

    MK1709 Registered

    12
    1
    Do you have any proven hints that the po2 was reason on this incident? What about CO2 or strocke? A post of Mr NetDoc being proved and allowed from someone not known giving out assumptions should not be the source. Even if it was spotted a valve been closed at the surface it could have various reasons.. If you know the protocol to akt once a drawn is back at surface it says to close the valves to have gasses left for analyses... As long nowbody could do a proved statemt it's all wild assumptions
     
  3. The Chairman

    The Chairman Chairman of the Board Staff Member

    # of Dives: I just don't log dives
    Location: Cave Country!
    61,682
    30,105
    Two others have corroborated the story here. Three others have corroborated the story to me personally. The O2 was indeed off. We can look for and invent many reasons why this person died, or we can accept the reality that no one can live without O2. No one.
     
  4. CuzzA

    CuzzA Percoidea Wetwork for Hire ScubaBoard Supporter

    18,716
    32,410
    @MK1709 regarding your reply to @kwinter I think you're confusing the purpose of this forum. If we we're only allowed to post undeniable facts there would not be much activity or a lot to learn as most diving accident reports are very limited with information. So, it's perfectly acceptable to discuss issues surrounding what little we know even if they might not be 100% accurate as to what happened.

    For example, I have interest in CCR, now I know if an instructor says he's going to put a neoprene cover over my mask for a lights out drill, I'll tell him to shove it. That may not have ever occured in this incident, but nevertheless I learned something, which is the purpose of this forum.
     
    Last edited: Apr 17, 2016
  5. lv2dive

    lv2dive Formerly known as KatePNAtl

    # of Dives: I'm a Fish!
    Location: Lake City, FL
    2,795
    2,084
    it sounds like the unit the decedent was diving was a JJ, and I think JJ's all have Shearwater electronics running them... Whether or not the loop somehow went hypoxic is a binary question that should easily answerable. If the loop didn't go hypoxic, then the O2 being off is less likely to be the facilitating factor.
     
  6. MK1709

    MK1709 Registered

    12
    1
    No one is contradict the one fact we need O2 vor survive on an alien environment but I did not read any tread up on here of someone was personal on place and deliver facts.. As you seems to act as some administrator I would expect a little more giving out facts or assumptions..
     
  7. The Chairman

    The Chairman Chairman of the Board Staff Member

    # of Dives: I just don't log dives
    Location: Cave Country!
    61,682
    30,105
    Yet, you don't want to accept the facts as given. It doesn't appear that English is your native language, so that alone may be the problem. I've been pretty clear and transparent in what I know and what I suspect.
     
  8. MK1709

    MK1709 Registered

    12
    1
    Dear CuzzA this is not what I aiming for.. Please go ahead with different scenarios and what if discussions.. But as long you are stumbling around with assumptions I do think it is not the place to publish Names of affected people.. Thanks
     
  9. Germie

    Germie Tech Instructor

    # of Dives: 1,000 - 2,499
    Location: Netherlands
    675
    559
    In standards of iantd is written too that you must always be able to see your hud. Closing O2 valve by instructor I don't like.
    None of my ccr instructors has done this.
     
    Jax, Seya and MK1709 like this.
  10. MK1709

    MK1709 Registered

    12
    1
    You don't need to care on my language skills as they are good enough..
     

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