"Cave Fills".....Really?

[Capt Scotty]

Every so often you see a tread somewhere here on the board about overfilling LP steel tanks. As a shop owner or Dive Boat operator, what is your real feelings about this? If the tank manufacture wanted you to fill their tank to 3500 why did that stamp it 2400? Is a customer right by demanding that you break the rules and overfill?

 

[Doppler]

Good topic.

I have heard all the excuses and all the work arounds. I have been told to replace burst discs, double them up, and have owned European tanks and valves not fitted with any Over-Pressure Relief other than a neck oring.

For the record, I am personally uncomfortable suggesting to anyone that they should do something outside best practice.

And telling someone who is filling cylinders for me to deviate from his or her normal practice is a poor idea.

 

[underH2Oman]

I do not prescribe to overfilling. Besides the cost for a fill being as low as it is just means I will take an extra tank if needed. From the industry side PSI's website says it best...
https://www.psicylinders.com/inspectors/library/33-did-you-know

U.S. employees, and perhaps others, working with and around high pressure cylinders must have pressure related HAZMAT training every 3 years and whenever their duties change.
DOT regulations for the E12479 scuba cylinder requires the cylinder to be inspected at least annually and specifically by a PSI, Inc trained visual inspector.
Federal law provides for civil penalties up to $27,000.00 for violations of the Hazardous Materials regulations. PSI training greatly reduces the likelihood of non-compliance. Willful violation could result in a $250,000.00 fine and prison.

Why would anyone risk fines as high as they are for a less than $10 sale

 

[Wookie]

No, when the SHTF (whatever the S is) and you're on the witness stand, and the opposing lawyer asks you if you provide cave fills and you answer yes, then he asks you what other safe practices you ignore, how you gonna answer that?

Your customer who demands cave fills needs a rebreather. But he's too cheap for that, otherwise he'd have a hp cylinder and a big one at that.

 

[Trace Malinowski]

Tell them a "cave fill" according to most training agencies in anything with a starting volume of 140 cubic feet or greater.

 

[Cave Diver]

Funny, but the highest "cave fill" I ever got was by a dive boat operator in the keys without me asking. Filled my LP108's to 4400 psi because he forgot to check the compressor...

 

[abyss_scuba]

I am not going to jeopardize all the money I have invested in my business for a couple of bucks. If you need more air get a bigger tank, get a set of doubles. I might fill to 10% over if I am in a rush and don't want wait for it to cool down.

 

[The Chairman]

Some divers see this as a given... I don't.

 

[Kristi@CCDS]

Every so often you see a tread somewhere here on the board about overfilling LP steel tanks. As a shop owner or Dive Boat operator, what is your real feelings about this? If the tank manufacture wanted you to fill their tank to 3500 why did that stamp it 2400? Is a customer right by demanding that you break the rules and overfill?

If you are uncomfortable with it I would simply tell them you are the one taking on the risk while filling the tank, your shop carries all the liability and you feel safe filling it to 'x' pressure. The customer will either accept that or they won't and will likely go elsewhere but at least you aren't put in an uncomfortable position. Safety first!