Challenge in videos maybe someone has some ideas on...

[ronscuba]

So you are using cineform to convert you raw files to avi ? If so, that is good. I assume when you convert, you set cineform to leave it at 30p ?

In Vegas, set the project settings to match your cineform file. It's an option you can choose. This way Vegas will be set to exactly match your file in resolution, frame rate, progressive, etc..

Motion blur and motion artifacting are 2 different things. Motion artifacting is due to compression by the camera, the compression editing in Vegas or the compression in Youtube. Motion artifacting is a bad thing. Motion blur is affected by the shutter speed. The motion blur can look natural, stuttered or it can look detailed for a special affect like slow motion.

I would shoot at shutter 1/60, and start at ISO at 1250. Shutter 1/60 will give you natural looking motion blur.

Blurriness on non moving objects is a function of focus and aperture.

Forget about flim look for now. That's a whole different topic and more suited to topside shooting at 24p and shallow depth of field.

I would also forget about youtube for now. Get your avi and edited footage to look how you want 1st. If you are not happy with that, then you will never be happy with youtube.

 

[danvolker]

So you are using cineform to convert you raw files to avi ? If so, that is good. I assume when you convert, you set cineform to leave it at 30p ?

In Vegas, set the project settings to match your cineform file. It's an option you can choose. This way Vegas will be set to exactly match your file in resolution, frame rate, progressive, etc..

Motion blur and motion artifacting are 2 different things. Motion artifacting is due to compression by the camera, the compression editing in Vegas or the compression in Youtube. Motion artifacting is a bad thing. Motion blur is affected by the shutter speed. The motion blur can look natural, stuttered or it can look detailed for a special affect like slow motion.

I would shoot at shutter 1/60, and start at ISO at 1250. Shutter 1/60 will give you natural looking motion blur.

Blurriness on non moving objects is a function of focus and aperture.

Forget about flim look for now. That's a whole different topic and more suited to topside shooting at 24p and shallow depth of field.

I would also forget about youtube for now. Get your avi and edited footage to look how you want 1st. If you are not happy with that, then you will never be happy with youtube.

Thanks Ron!

 

[danvolker]

So you are using cineform to convert you raw files to avi ? If so, that is good. I assume when you convert, you set cineform to leave it at 30p ?

In Vegas, set the project settings to match your cineform file. It's an option you can choose. This way Vegas will be set to exactly match your file in resolution, frame rate, progressive, etc..
.

I import the mov files into HD link which converts them for First Light and into the cineform codec.

I then import the cineform avi clips into Vegas, and use the NTSC 29.970 frame rate of the cineform codec... On looking at the properties of a clip from one of these imports, the properties box shows Field order as upper field first.....this is strange, as the canon mov clips are proressive video, and I can't imagine why field order would show like this--it "should" be showing as NONE in the box. This may be a call to the tech support at NeoHD ....
It also shows the Alpha channel as Premultiplied, and this is something I have not yet read about--have no idea what effect this would suggest.

In my normal editing, the project properties of Vegas are set to a custom setting.....HD 1920x 1080 29.970 fps field order [ None] Progressive Scan
pixel aspect ration 1.0
pixel format 32 bit floating point full range
Motion blur type [Gaussian] would not know enough here to think to change this setting.
Deinterlace method set to none.....could be problematic if Cineform codec is creating an interlaced "upper field first" effect without my desiring that!!!


When done editing, I render an avi file ( cineform avi, filmscan 2) and then use the Sorrenson Squeeze program to create either a BluRay or a youtube level of compression, depending on what I need. I know there are a few other editing platforms other than vegas, that would not have you waste the time having to render an avi, prior to the compression encode, but I know Vegas fairly well, and don't have time right now to get efficient on Premiere ( which I also have).

 

[ronscuba]

In the Vegas project properties window, on the template line, all the way to the right is a folder symbol. If you mouse over it, it says "match media settings". Click on the folder symbol. A new window will open up. In that window, select one of your video files that was converted with cineform. Vegas project properties will then perfectly match your cineform files.

I'm still curious to hear at what point do you 1st see video that you don't like ? Your raw files out of the camera, the converted cineform files, the Vegas rendered files, the Sorenson files or youtube ?

When I play around with different render settings, I usually use a 10-30 second test video.

 

[danvolker]

In the Vegas project properties window, on the template line, all the way to the right is a folder symbol. If you mouse over it, it says "match media settings". Click on the folder symbol. A new window will open up. In that window, select one of your video files that was converted with cineform. Vegas project properties will then perfectly match your cineform files.

I'm still curious to hear at what point do you 1st see video that you don't like ? Your raw files out of the camera, the converted cineform files, the Vegas rendered files, the Sorenson files or youtube ?

When I play around with different render settings, I usually use a 10-30 second test video.

Ron,'
From this post from you, I found that the HD Link program for NeoHD makes the clips have an "Upper Field first" field order----so I believe this means it MUST be interlacing my progressive footage from the Canon.....I can find a control in the preferences for HDLink to set it to be progressive---and in fact, I ran a conversion with it last night of some clips I had not used yet...they STILL came out as upper field first...I used the match settings as you suggested for vegas, after converting the files.

The point before where I first noticed serious issues with motion artifacts and apparent jerkiness, was in the Youtube video I did of my first Juno Ledge dive with the camera on full manual except for shutter speed. After a few posts by you, I looked at the original avi carefully, and saw a less exagerated version of the same artifacts ...

YouTube - friday-progressive this is the dive I just did over again, using Vegas to deinterlace, interpolate setting, and then Sorrenson to render the h264 and publish to Youtube. It was shot full auto, but it is much crisper, and less "shaky or jerky"--which I think is a motion artifact. I doubt I got exponentially worse in holding the camera while shooting

The juno ledge video which I did manual but without shutter control, YouTube - juno-ledge was ruined I think by the camera setting the shutter at a very slow setting---at least that's what I am telling myself until I get to try some faster shutter speeds today. I really wish the Aquatica housing would allow me to make shutter speed changes without taking the camera out!!!!

I had never tried watching the mov files just out of the camera... I could run these off the camera with the mini hdmi conection, onto my lcd tv.....I can try later .
Normally, my first view is after the conversion to cineform and First light, so the PC can play the clips without stuttering ( the mov files don't run smoothly like the cineform files do).

 

[Travis Matteson]

Dan what are the specs of your computer and what OS are you using? You should be able to play the mov files without stutter. Have you installed any codecs such as shark007 codecs? I highly recommend doing so and then playing the files with windows media player/media player classic/ or vlc.

 

[danvolker]

Dan what are the specs of your computer and what OS are you using? You should be able to play the mov files without stutter. Have you installed any codecs such as shark007 codecs? I highly recommend doing so and then playing the files with windows media player/media player classic/ or vlc.

Hi Travis,
ASUS CG 1330
windows 7, 64 bit PC with 8 gis ram....AMD Phenom II xs 1045t processor 2.70 ghz

Have not heard of the shark007 codec....I will google it. thanks.

 

[ronscuba]

I believe I read somewhere that the cineform files are progressive, but just flagged incorrectly as interlaced. You can test this by capturing a single frame to a picture file in Vegas. It should be pretty obvious if it is interlaced.

After setting project properties to match media of your cineform file, change the properties to progressive and leave everything else alone.

I would lock the shutter at 1/60 on your next dive.