Cold-water vs warm-water training

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also down south is more appealing 'cause its feb.!!!!!!
..and it's warm and sunny down there!!!!.
...and the people are reaaaaalllllly freindly!!!!!
.....and you don't have to cut the water with a chainsaw before you get in...!!!!!

...can i go tooo????
have fun whatever and wherever you decide!!!!!
yaeg:D
 
also down south is more appealing 'cause its feb.!!!!!!
..and it's warm and sunny down there!!!!.
...and the people are reaaaaalllllly freindly!!!!!
.....and you don't have to cut the water with a chainsaw before you get in...!!!!!

...can i go tooo????
have fun whatever and wherever you decide!!!!!
yaeg:D

too bad I wouldn't be going before it's also warm and sunny here and the water doesn't need to be cut with a chainsaw... lol
 
While I do agree that the conditions are different and that people with the psychological and physical fortitude to get into cold water will find it relatively easier to get into warm water afterward as opposed to those who are used to warm water having to get into cold water, I do not believe there is any significant difference in "instructional methodology" that makes Canada-based dive pros any better prepared to teach than those who train elsewhere.

This, on the other hand, makes sense. It's helpful to do your internship in the area where you hope to be working after you become a pro. The rhythm of the shop, the course setup, the expectations of the customers, the typical scheduling--those are all different where students and divers are "weekend warriors" taking and conducting courses in bite-sized chunks as compared to places where instructors and students are engaged in intensive training and diving over many days in a row. If you are planning on working in Canada after you finish, it's logical to get your intial training in Canada.

In colder, lower-viz locales one tends to become much more conservative when training. When the standards call for direct supervision, that means being able to get to & put your hands on a student quickly, not just watch them from a greater distance simply because the vis allows you to do so.

For example: Instructor-student ratios. Standards indicate that you may have 8 students to one Instructor in OW. However, the reality of temperate diving is that ratio is not really a good idea unless you have a CA or another Instructor with you.

Likewise compass training. In cold water where you may not be able to see very far, this part of the OW course may be stressed and practiced more than if the course was taught in warmer waters where the visibility is much better.

IOW, instructional methodologies DO differ because where the Instructor is trained DOES make a difference.
 
To be honest, new OWSIs in a tropical place are more likely to be doing dozens upon dozens of DSDs rather than teaching, for example, Rescue classes, so their induction into teaching is likely to be gradual anyway.

If you do your DM followed soon after by the IDC in a tropical place, as a junior instructor, in addition to DSDs, you may be called on to assist in OW and other courses, especially if the student groups are large or need to be split for the in-water sessions. If you are worried about gaining experience before going south, you should think of how long it will actually take you to get this experience. How many summers will you require in Canada as a DM before you take the next step and do the IDC? How many classes are you likely to be able to assist with each summer? Now how long will that same experience take you to garner in a tropical location? This is one of the points Andy is making in post 12.

You seem to be under the impression that either the dive population in Canada is very small or that the season is extremely short. I can assure that neither is the case.

In the area where the OP lives as well as the neighbouring province of Ontario, there is a large diving population.

As to how long the dive season lasts, even if one does not do ice diving, one can almost dive year round. All it takes is becoming a drysuit diver.

Furthermore, becoming a good DM is not a matter of how quickly one "goes through" the course, but more a matter of setting your own pace and learning all you can along the way.
 
In colder, lower-viz locales one tends to become much more conservative when training. When the standards call for direct supervision, that means being able to get to & put your hands on a student quickly, not just watch them from a greater distance simply because the vis allows you to do so.

For example: Instructor-student ratios. Standards indicate that you may have 8 students to one Instructor in OW. However, the reality of temperate diving is that ratio is not really a good idea unless you have a CA or another Instructor with you.

Likewise compass training. In cold water where you may not be able to see very far, this part of the OW course may be stressed and practiced more than if the course was taught in warmer waters where the visibility is much better.

IOW, instructional methodologies DO differ because where the Instructor is trained DOES make a difference.
We will just have to agree to disagree. In my own classes, I never am out of reaching distance of my (very few in a single class) students.
Regardless of the water clarity.
It has absolutely nothing to do with instructional methodology.

In my own classes, I conduct navigation training in places where students cannot just look and go. This has to do with how individual instructors conduct their courses.
Regardless of water temperature.
It has absolutely nothing to do with instructional methodology.

You seem to be under the impression that either the dive population in Canada is very small or that the season is extremely short. I can assure that neither is the case.

In the area where the OP lives as well as the neighbouring province of Ontario, there is a large diving population.

As to how long the dive season lasts, even if one does not do ice diving, one can almost dive year round. All it takes is becoming a drysuit diver.

Furthermore, becoming a good DM is not a matter of how quickly one "goes through" the course, but more a matter of setting your own pace and learning all you can along the way.
Oh, I know that there's a significant diving population in that part of Canada. Many of my own customers come from Montreal and Toronto and environs. I also know how often most of them dive, and among the instructors and DMs I know in the area, the vast majority have "day jobs," meaning that their principal occupations are not scuba-related whereas most DMs and instructors in places like where I work are full-time scuba professionals. Nothing wrong with either option, but it is something for the OP to consider when she's making her own decision.

It's not so much a question of pacing oneself but rather intensity. Depending on the learner and his/her learning style, a more relaxed rhythm might be indicated or a more intensive one. Again, there's nothing wrong with either one, but it is something for the OP to consider.

I've got no dog in this fight--she's not thinking of coming to me for her training, and I don't live in either place nor feel any need to defend either place. Rather than trying to sway her towards one option or away from another (as you are doing), I am just giving her food for thought.
 
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Nothing wrong with either option, but it is something for the OP to consider when he's making his own decision.

I think the debate that's starting to occur here is food for thought just as much as the actual answers are. Sure you can dive around here year round as SubMariner mentioned, but that got me thinking. You CAN dive, but if you want to, you'd better plan it all yourself, the lds is going to have pretty much nothing to do with any local open water diving between november and april, unless it's ice diving on the (fairly) rare occasion. => no work for 3-4 months and little for another 2-3...

I'm beginning to think I should change my avatar to be more obviously female. :wink:
 
I think the debate that's starting to occur here is food for thought just as much as the actual answers are. Sure you can dive around here year round as SubMariner mentioned, but that got me thinking. You CAN dive, but if you want to, you'd better plan it all yourself, the lds is going to have pretty much nothing to do with any local open water diving between november and april, unless it's ice diving on the (fairly) rare occasion. => no work for 3-4 months and little for another 2-3...

I'm beginning to think I should change my avatar to be more obviously female. :wink:

Yes, same is true of Nova Scotia and, I'm sure, much of the NE states. Then most years we spend Jan.-March on the N. Gulf Coast--when it's "too cold" to find local buddies easily.
 
I'm beginning to think I should change my avatar to be more obviously female. :wink:
Sorry! As a female diver myself, I should know better than to slip into pronouns based on the "law of averages."
 
Oreo...I find interesting that you thought that by coming here you would get a clear answer. Prob over 95% of all treads end up with diversity in opinions.

For one, it is not a race. Secondly, do not be surpsised if you ask a LDS as to what would be best and he says...me. BTW, I have a pretty good idea what shop you might be referring to ...in the west end. They seem to be very assertive in promoting Going Pro. Based on what I gathered you still tend to do a fair bit of diving at exotic locations...Blackbeard, Bonaire, etc. Therefore, diving warm water is not an oddity to you. Might just want to do your internship locally which could prove perhaps to be a bit cheaper and set money aside to either do a couple of trips at more exotic locations or to do an IDC somewhere else. By doing so, it will also give you more time to analyse the various factors and come up with what you think is best for you. Normally people will tell you what would be best for them...normal because you sak for their opinion.

Many treads talking about McDiving schools on this forum. I truely believe same exist for IDC locally or abroad. Make sure you will pick one that has a good reputation and not one people will frown upon when you show your cards or certificates. As I said, it is not a race.

All the best in your endeavours
 
Sorry! As a female diver myself, I should know better than to slip into pronouns based on the "law of averages."

I've noticed that the law of averages very much applies here on SB, even when somebody's username clearly implies female. (so no offence taken)

Oreo...I find interesting that you thought that by coming here you would get a clear answer. Prob over 95% of all treads end up with diversity in opinions.

Ok, maybe I should have said give me the ability to make a clear decision, which I think to some degree, it has.

do not be surpsised if you ask a LDS as to what would be best and he says...me. BTW, I have a pretty good idea what shop you might be referring to ...in the west end. They seem to be very assertive in promoting Going Pro.

If by "assertive in promoting" you mean allowing (possibly even encouraging) people to sign up for zero-to-hero, then yes. There were 3 people at their info night who are not yet certified, two of whom had just signed up for a OW/AOW package deal (and possibly further than that, but I'm not certain).

I had a dream the other night where their course director looked at my gear (SP reg and Zeagle bc, neither of which he sells) and said "well that's not safe". When I asked him at the info session, he essentially impliedthat gear he doesn't sell isn't guaranteed to be safe (or possibly gave students the illusion that gear he sells may not be safe because I wasn't using it?). I've decided that I'm not going to go there for pro training because among other things, some of their business practices have started to stink. I'll pm you to see if we're thinking of the same place.
 
https://www.shearwater.com/products/teric/

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