What's wrong with holding the purge button down? That's a pretty scary response from an instructor...
Cozumel-Diver lost
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What's wrong with holding the purge button down? That's a pretty scary response from an instructor...
I thought he was referring to that one location specifically, rather than 1 DM to 6 divers on every dive site.
pilot fish
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Begin at the beginning, OK? If you KNOW something, post what you know that refutes speculation. As it is, you are doing the same thing you claim the rest of us are doing, speculating. One might wonder if you are just protecting Coz?
pilot fish
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UnderSeaBumbleBee
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Betsy and Bob, please post a link, phone number, address, or publication information on the OFFICIAL REPORTS. You claim they exist, please tell us the location. Or is it speculation that official reports exist that the general public may both review and discuss?
I look forward to your reply as I think having the official reports made available to this board willl be of great help to the scuba community on this board. Betsy and Bob, I want to thank you for making diving safer by providing the information on the "official reports". It is great that you are going to stop all the specing going on here and provide us with some "official reports".
I look forward to your reply as I think having the official reports made available to this board willl be of great help to the scuba community on this board. Betsy and Bob, I want to thank you for making diving safer by providing the information on the "official reports". It is great that you are going to stop all the specing going on here and provide us with some "official reports".
dman1959
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For those among you who wish to beat the "off a cruise ship" [dead horse] point further ...
I dive a cruise ship all the time but rarely use the operators offered by the cruise ship . I could use what they offer - it would make no difference except in the $s left in my pocket. Will let you guess my experience and level of training because most of your comments are laden with unsubstantiated assumption. You can add comments about me to the pile and then take the value of your opinions and $1 and still buy yourself a cup of coffee at McDs. Congrats on your magnificent accomplishment !
Why not just wish the family of the lost diver the best , say a prayer, etc. ?
I dive a cruise ship all the time but rarely use the operators offered by the cruise ship . I could use what they offer - it would make no difference except in the $s left in my pocket. Will let you guess my experience and level of training because most of your comments are laden with unsubstantiated assumption. You can add comments about me to the pile and then take the value of your opinions and $1 and still buy yourself a cup of coffee at McDs. Congrats on your magnificent accomplishment !
Why not just wish the family of the lost diver the best , say a prayer, etc. ?
RonFrank
Contributor
Bob,
I have been criticizing the speculation on this thread as well since the beginning.
If you or Betsy have information, please post it. So far all both of you have done is tell everyone they are wrong... but that does not really accomplish much.
I have posted what I could find based on the news, and no more. That is not much.
I agree the rest is speculation, but it will continue.
Official report? One thing I have NEVER seen out of Coz is a *official report* on a diving accident. Heck, we can't even find much in the local papers......
Personally, I don't think there is much to be learned from this. A diver or diveOP screwed up, and someone died....
I have been criticizing the speculation on this thread as well since the beginning.
If you or Betsy have information, please post it. So far all both of you have done is tell everyone they are wrong... but that does not really accomplish much.
I have posted what I could find based on the news, and no more. That is not much.
I agree the rest is speculation, but it will continue.
Official report? One thing I have NEVER seen out of Coz is a *official report* on a diving accident. Heck, we can't even find much in the local papers......
Personally, I don't think there is much to be learned from this. A diver or diveOP screwed up, and someone died....
dschonbrun
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Bo, Betsy, Official reports of dive accidents rarely if ever are made public. Diving agencies make sure they are kept quiet so diving maintains a fairly clean safety record.
fisherdvm
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I find the newspaper frequently mislead, misreport, and something careless in reporting. It is better having hearsay, and undocumented second hand information than waiting for an official report. Autopsy report are protected by HIPPA law in the US, and I am not sure if the hospital/coroner is even allowed to release it to the news media.
In the past, I've requested it from coroners, and they've discussed things with me knowing I was involved in a case. But now, you can't get them to say a word without a written consent from the next of kin.
In the same way, I think law enforcement are regulated by similar privacy laws.... and the dive op is probably under advisement from their attorney not to talk to anyone but them. So, we will just have to rely on inaccurate hearsay to discuss about how to prevent such an accident.
That reminds me, should I pack my pony tank and suffer the harassement of US/mexican custom this weekend, or should I just risk it and dive without a pony?
In the past, I've requested it from coroners, and they've discussed things with me knowing I was involved in a case. But now, you can't get them to say a word without a written consent from the next of kin.
In the same way, I think law enforcement are regulated by similar privacy laws.... and the dive op is probably under advisement from their attorney not to talk to anyone but them. So, we will just have to rely on inaccurate hearsay to discuss about how to prevent such an accident.
That reminds me, should I pack my pony tank and suffer the harassement of US/mexican custom this weekend, or should I just risk it and dive without a pony?
jd950
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I am confused. Someone posts something they heard from one of the boat captains on the island. We discussed the implications of those statements with language like "if true" "if that's right" etc. The captains all know one another and communicate constantly by radio during the day. They reasonably should know.
Then I see others say the information is 90% false (which clearly implies they know the truth) and criticize those who are discussing it. Fine. If you know the truth, speak it. Otherwise, you don't know and shouldn't imply otherwise. As far as waiting for official information...when has anyone, in recorded history, waited for official information before discussing a subject of interest? If you simply get so upset that you want to tear your hair out whenever people are speculating and discussing events without having all of the facts, then no offense, but you must lead either a frustrating or very sheltered life, or have no hair.
Let's be real here. A lot of people dive Cozumel. A lot of people dive the devil's throat. Those of us for whom that is true are interested in the details, including the location and the dive op. That's how it is, everywhere, always. Add to that the fact that given the opportunity, those who investigate this would be just as happy to have the whole incident go away and not scare the tourists, and you will have discussions. I would want to know what happened and who the dive op was so I could decide if I want to use that op next time.
This is a public forum and unless someone learned facts through some confidential relationship, there is no privacy issue. For all we know, this poor woman had a heart attack, but also for all we know there may have been gross negligence on her part or the part of someone else. Putting aside all the cruise ship diver and Asian diver stuff, I see nothing wrong with people seeking information and discussing what they hear. More importantly, it is human nature and it isn't going to change.
As many politicians have learned, if an event is of interest and those with the facts sit on those facts or delay their release, or conceal them, it won't stop discussion, it will just make the discussion focus on rumor, suspicion and innuendo, which may well be worse than the truth.
Then I see others say the information is 90% false (which clearly implies they know the truth) and criticize those who are discussing it. Fine. If you know the truth, speak it. Otherwise, you don't know and shouldn't imply otherwise. As far as waiting for official information...when has anyone, in recorded history, waited for official information before discussing a subject of interest? If you simply get so upset that you want to tear your hair out whenever people are speculating and discussing events without having all of the facts, then no offense, but you must lead either a frustrating or very sheltered life, or have no hair.
Let's be real here. A lot of people dive Cozumel. A lot of people dive the devil's throat. Those of us for whom that is true are interested in the details, including the location and the dive op. That's how it is, everywhere, always. Add to that the fact that given the opportunity, those who investigate this would be just as happy to have the whole incident go away and not scare the tourists, and you will have discussions. I would want to know what happened and who the dive op was so I could decide if I want to use that op next time.
This is a public forum and unless someone learned facts through some confidential relationship, there is no privacy issue. For all we know, this poor woman had a heart attack, but also for all we know there may have been gross negligence on her part or the part of someone else. Putting aside all the cruise ship diver and Asian diver stuff, I see nothing wrong with people seeking information and discussing what they hear. More importantly, it is human nature and it isn't going to change.
As many politicians have learned, if an event is of interest and those with the facts sit on those facts or delay their release, or conceal them, it won't stop discussion, it will just make the discussion focus on rumor, suspicion and innuendo, which may well be worse than the truth.
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