D400v

[diveprof]

Has management of ScubaPro given any thoughts to a D400V (along the lines of the 250V)? This was a wonderful reg and used regs of this type are still in high demand. Why not capitalize on a successful reg? The 650 was not a successful attempt to head in that direction, but I believe that if you adhere to the true D400 design that you would have a very successful reg.

 

[nfarrar]

While on vacation in the Caymans earlier this month an instructor from a SP LDS here in the states told me that there SP rep was talking about an all metal D400 style reg. I dont know how much stock I put in it but thought Id share. I too would love a D400v. I have 3 classic D400s.

Later Mon,
Nick

 

[diveprof]

While on vacation in the Caymans earlier this month an instructor from a SP LDS here in the states told me that there SP rep was talking about an all metal D400 style reg. I dont know how much stock I put in it but thought Id share. I too would love a D400v. I have 3 classic D400s.

Later Mon,
Nick

Love the idea that they are looking at 400 type reg, cannot imagine what an "all metal" would look like. I would hope that they would keep the rubber purge?? I think a reissue of the D400 would be sucessful without any new whistles and bells. Hope they do not screw it up like the 650. Lucky you - 3 D400s! Oughta be a law against owning that many of these regs....(envy, envy : ) )

 

[SCUBAPRO Harry]

Thank you for the input; at this time there is no plan for a vintage D400 although it certainly was a great regulator.

 

[diveprof]

It was and is a great reg. Quite a demand in the "used" reg arena. Your loss. Maybe others will pick up where y'all left off.... BTW I am a SP fan and own two of their regs.

 

[DA Aquamaster]

At the time, I was told the D400 was discontinued in part as it was "different" to service, and some (many?) techs had problems adjusting them properly.

I both agreed with that and found it ironic, as several years prior to that my inability to find a tech who could properly tune and service my D400s resulted in my doing it myself, and my ability to tune mine properly resulted in my getting taken on as a tech by the local SP dealer. It's how I got started in reg repair.

In my opinion, some of the tuning issues were do to changes in the poppets and in the switch to the less than wonderful plastic seats in the late style aspirator. The plastic seats just were not as sharp and the later poppets often defied proper seating, although running the new poppet through an ultrasound machine seemed to help a lot.

The last straw was the last lever they used with a two sided surface stamped in it. I hated those things. My opinion was that over time, Scubapro managed to take an excellent reg with superb subjective breathing performance and basically no case fault geometry issues and detune it to the point of mediocrity, due to both the plastic seat and due to meeting the really stupid CE free flow standards.

In that regard, I'd love to see a D400V along the lines of the original D400 - pre plastic orifice and with the original lever.

Scubapro marketed the X650 as the D400 replacement and it looked ok in the sales brochure. The problem was that the marketing ploy of using the angled diaphragm of the D400 is actually counter productive in terms of case geometry fault (negating the primary advantages of the D400) if you don't retain the D400s coaxial exhaust valve. That along with inadequate testing, pre-mature release, QA issues on the levers as well as issues with the grind used in the case all conspired to kill it off in short order after a couple recalls killed it's reputation and consumer confidence even after the QA issues were resolved.

*But* if Scubapro would redesign the X650 with a coaxial exhaust valve, they'd capture most of the advantages of the D400 and still maintain general commonality with servicing their other current second stage designs.

 

[diveprof]

At the time, I was told the D400 was discontinued in part as it was "different" to service, and some (many?) techs had problems adjusting them properly.

I both agreed with that and found it ironic, as several years prior to that my inability to find a tech who could properly tune and service my D400s resulted in my doing it myself, and my ability to tune mine properly resulted in my getting taken on as a tech by the local SP dealer. It's how I got started in reg repair.

In my opinion, some of the tuning issues were do to changes in the poppets and in the switch to the less than wonderful plastic seats in the late style aspirator. The plastic seats just were not as sharp and the later poppets often defied proper seating, although running the new poppet through an ultrasound machine seemed to help a lot.

The last straw was the last lever they used with a two sided surface stamped in it. I hated those things. My opinion was that over time, Scubapro managed to take an excellent reg with superb subjective breathing performance and basically no case fault geometry issues and detune it to the point of mediocrity, due to both the plastic seat and due to meeting the really stupid CE free flow standards.

In that regard, I'd love to see a D400V along the lines of the original D400 - pre plastic orifice and with the original lever.

Scubapro marketed the X650 as the D400 replacement and it looked ok in the sales brochure. The problem was that the marketing ploy of using the angled diaphragm of the D400 is actually counter productive in terms of case geometry fault (negating the primary advantages of the D400) if you don't retain the D400s coaxial exhaust valve. That along with inadequate testing, pre-mature release, QA issues on the levers as well as issues with the grind used in the case all conspired to kill it off in short order after a couple recalls killed it's reputation and consumer confidence even after the QA issues were resolved.

*But* if Scubapro would redesign the X650 with a coaxial exhaust valve, they'd capture most of the advantages of the D400 and still maintain general commonality with servicing their other current second stage designs.

I agree with your comments, though I would rather see a D400V in a package that looks more like the original D400 design (with original D400 parts-seats, lever and poppet) than the X650 (that just looked weird). Still, I would argue that the issue is really in the training of the techs that service the D400. Our local tech serviced them just fine and many swear by this as their fav reg.

 

[DA Aquamaster]

Personally, I think the D400 is easy to tune - all it really requires is leaving some slack in the lever at the beginning of the process and then doing things in the right sequence. But if a tech encounters one for the first time and has no one in the shop to mentor him, the learning curve is pretty steep and the directions are scant.