Diver Dies in the Galapagos on Peter Hughes boat

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Why keep writing posts that may upset the family and friends of this person. There is way to little information here for any of us to be able to draw any conclusions, so it's all wild speculation. Yes, you can learn from the facts...if you know them. In this case we don't.
Autopsy says drowning, and vomit in the lungs is quite common as salt water drowning easily causes vomiting as a reflex, so all we know it's sadly a drowning.
There are 1001 reasons why and how a diver can drown, so no use going on for ever just guessing why or how, because that will indeed be endless and useless torture for those people who knew this person well.
 
You may not realize this, but reading scubaboard is entirely optional...
There was a discussion (or maybe it is a new rule?) on the Decostop recently that the names of the victims should not be used, and I somewhat agree with that (although donna , john, or frank for that matter, are common enough).

Why keep writing posts that may upset the family and friends of this person. There is way to little information here for any of us to be able to draw any conclusions, so it's all wild speculation. Yes, you can learn from the facts...if you know them. In this case we don't.
Autopsy says drowning, and vomit in the lungs is quite common as salt water drowning easily causes vomiting as a reflex, so all we know it's sadly a drowning.
There are 1001 reasons why and how a diver can drown, so no use going on for ever just guessing why or how, because that will indeed be endless and useless torture for those people who knew this person well.
 
Why keep writing posts that may upset the family and friends of this person. There is way to little information here for any of us to be able to draw any conclusions, so it's all wild speculation. Yes, you can learn from the facts...if you know them. In this case we don't.
Autopsy says drowning, and vomit in the lungs is quite common as salt water drowning easily causes vomiting as a reflex, so all we know it's sadly a drowning.
There are 1001 reasons why and how a diver can drown, so no use going on for ever just guessing why or how, because that will indeed be endless and useless torture for those people who knew this person well.

The primary purpose of this, the Accidents and Incidents forum, is analysis, in order to learn as much as possible from incidents. The end goal is education, to help people avoid similar problems, and just possibly to save someone else's life some time in the future.

People without much of a diving background may also be reading here looking to understand and make sense of a particular tragedy. Regulars of this forum are happy to help them understand diving and the risks involved. That being said, all newcomers have to understand that accident analysis can seem brutal to those who aren't used to it, particularly if they're already understandably upset. Although non-divers, family and friends are most certainly welcome here in this forum, and we definitely appreciate any information they may be able to provide, for their own sake, they may not want to keep reading. If someone is upset, they should consider not posting, even if you have valuable information. Follow-up questions seeking clarification often seem impersonal or even harsh.

An accident analysis may discuss different aspects of an incident. There's the factual information about what went wrong, including environmental conditions, the background of those directly involved, equipment, etc. Accidents are often the result of a chain of issues, and analysis also attempts to reconstruct possible sequences of events that may have led to the incident, since it may only take a single corrective action to have avoid the whole series of successive problems. However, because there is often of the lack of information, multiple hypotheses may be discussed, involving much supposition. It is not uncommon for people to ask why discussion isn't restricted only to known facts. The point of most accident analyses including the ones in this forum is to not only identify the specific issues in an incident, but also to identify what other accidents could theoretically have been likely to occur, because of similar causes or circumstances. Speculation is therefor a normal and expected part of any discussion in this forum. On the other hand, participants in the discussion are suppose to clearly distinguish between facts (and how well they may be known) and supposition. Purely hypothetical lines of reasoning should be clearly identified as such, since they didn't actually happen. They still have value though, if even one person takes the lesson and avoids a future serious or fatal accident.

People also ask why not just wait for the official report. Unfortunately, useful reports are extremely rare, and if they do come out, are long after the fact. Even in industrialized countries, there are only a few rare jurisdictions with the institutional knowledge as well as the resources to analyze dive accidents deeply enough to be useful for other divers. Los Angeles County comes to mind, with at least one of the people involved in investigations there occasionally posting in this forum. In most of the rest of the world, at best there's a Coroner/Medical Examiner/autopsy report that says "death by drowning" which is not particularly useful to divers looking to prevent the next accident. In many situations, there may be more knowledge, background and expertise in diving available in this forum than most local investigations have easy access to. To understand the root causes of what happened, the discussion here may be more education than most official reports. However, since it's a free-flowing Internet discussion where anyone can comment, it may also be more confusing or upsetting than any formal report.
 
There was a discussion (or maybe it is a new rule?) on the Decostop recently that the names of the victims should not be used, and I somewhat agree with that (although donna , john, or frank for that matter, are common enough).
When full names are left in news articles quoted, it can cause problems. The rule here used to be to remove those, but that changed; I think we need to change it back.

Please see Feedback forum thread Victims' Names in Accidents forum a problem; "No Condolences" rule is Not Working and add comments if you'd like.

thanks
 
By learning how accidents occurred, divers mighty be able to prevent accidents in the future. Therein lies the value of accident analysis.
 
It was after reading a long and speculative thread in this forum that I decided tojoin Scubaboard. I think it is very important that we are able to discus accidents/incidents as soon as possible before the details are forgotten.
In the event that I was involved in an accident/incident I would hope that anyone who could report the details would do so without any fear of criticism.
 
A good point. If a Medical Examiner finds water in the lungs, then he or she, appropriately, write, "Drowning." But the CE might not know what caused the water to get into the lungs or what started the chain if event leading to that.

Is there such a thing as a diving specific autopsy? Seems like that would include a whole different scope of testing.
 
I'm not sure about the autopsy but I know that investigations of diving accidents include investigation of the equipment used and an analysis of the diver's computer.
 


A ScubaBoard Staff Message...

Condolences moved here. Please keep this thread on topic. The topic is the mishap, what could have caused it, and how to avoid another such mishap in the future. Please review the special rules for the A&I forum if you have any question about what's appropriate here.
Thanks,
Rick
 
Is there such a thing as a diving specific autopsy? Seems like that would include a whole different scope of testing.
Based on what I remember from a talk by Noguchi, There are several techniques, mainly when looking for a gas embolism that are different from a conventional autopsy. Few coroners are familiar with them, few coroners are familiar with dive gear. Most autopsy do a disservice, they list the cause of death as drowning and don't really do any further.
 
https://www.shearwater.com/products/teric/

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