Diver drifts 3 miles

[Cave Diver]

Don't blow this out of proportion there my friend. We dive the Keys every month, including the Bibb, and sometimes the current will darn near rip your mask off on the way down, but once on the wreck the dives are great. Proper briefings, divers with adequate skills, and other factors come into play.

Just rolling over and letting the captain, who may or may not have mroe experieince diving in that locale than your group leader, decide for you is not always the nest option.

That's why I said there should be a meeting of the minds. To say that the captain is just the boat driver and should leave the decision to dive solely up to the divers is bad advice IMO.

 

[Reef_Haven]

A whistle would have come in handy. In my experience the tag line is on the surface to the down line. Would have been nice if the captain had observed the divers making their way from the current line to the down line. Apparently the diver submerged and tried to swim for the down line, but how far away would you drift before you realized you weren't going to make it? Should still have been within whistle range.

 

[DebbyDiver]

Had to laugh at Capt. Slate's comments. He didn't hold back, did he?

He never does. You never wonder where you stand with him. :snicker:

You are assuming it was a 3.5 knot current based on the newspaper report of 3 miles and 45 minutes later.

Trust nothing you hear on the news or read in a newspaper. My former spouse and I spent years in the news biz; believe me, trust nothing.

 

[deeper thoughts]

"Do you think the dive ops decision to anchor and allow people to dive on a wreck in 5' seas and a 3.5 knot surface current was a wise decision?"


I don't think that is a fair question to ask.

The dive operator just drives the boat, it is the divers who make the decision to dive or not. Whether conditions are "safe" or not depends on a lot of factors, and not just a yardstick measurement of wave height or a guestimate of the current.

True but the dive op was quick to cast judgement.

 

[ScooterSouthFlorida]

That's why I said there should be a meeting of the minds. To say that the captain is just the boat driver and should leave the decision to dive solely up to the divers is bad advice IMO.

I agree completely. The Captain of a vessel is responsible for all POB's and should in no way sacrifice the safety of anyone onboard for the sake of 'the dive.'

I would tend to doubt captain/boat error here, as my gut is telling me
1) It's a newspaper story, and 'facts' are sometimes not the facts, seas are sometimes exaggerated, etc. (Ever read a news story about a diver's 'oxygen' tank running low?? )

2) No matter the lil' letters you got in your wallet, OW, AOW, EAN, etc etc..., doesn't mean you're qualified to dive a certain dive at any given sea state.

3) I have seen one too many times divers 'bobble-head' in unison to the DM or Boat Driver that 'YES' they are all qualified and comfortable to make a dive, and you get in the water and see nothing but a cluster-F*** of divers ill-prepared, inexperienced, struggling, etc....

I would chock this one up to 'tourist diver syndrome'* and would agree, he screwed up.


* - Tourist Diver Syndrome, or TDS, can usually be identified as the following symptoms appearing in a diver; Every certification card up to snuff, shiny new dive gear, has done 4 dives in the last year all while on vacation, and figures 'sure I can do this dive' after getting certified in a pond some years ago in BFE, Midwest, USA.....

 

[Jupiter31]

Do you think the dive ops decision to anchor and allow people to dive on a wreck in 5' seas and a 3.5 knot surface current was a wise decision?

Sometimes the pocketbook wins

This has been the worst weather I've seen in 30+ years in FL - agree that a hot drop might have made more sense

 

[DebbyDiver]

I agree completely. The Captain of a vessel is responsible for all POB's and should in no way sacrifice the safety of anyone onboard for the sake of 'the dive.'

I would tend to doubt captain/boat error here, as my gut is telling me
1) It's a newspaper story, and 'facts' are sometimes not the facts, seas are sometimes exaggerated, etc. (Ever read a news story about a diver's 'oxygen' tank running low?? )

2) No matter the lil' letters you got in your wallet, OW, AOW, EAN, etc etc..., doesn't mean you're qualified to dive a certain dive at any given sea state.

3) I have seen one too many times divers 'bobble-head' in unison to the DM or Boat Driver that 'YES' they are all qualified and comfortable to make a dive, and you get in the water and see nothing but a cluster-F*** of divers ill-prepared, inexperienced, struggling, etc....

I would chock this one up to 'tourist diver syndrome'* and would agree, he screwed up.


* - Tourist Diver Syndrome, or TDS, can usually be identified as the following symptoms appearing in a diver; Every certification card up to snuff, shiny new dive gear, has done 4 dives in the last year all while on vacation, and figures 'sure I can do this dive' after getting certified in a pond some years ago in BFE, Midwest, USA.....

+1 to your entire post, and this bears repeating (with my correction):

It's a newspaper story, and 'facts' are [-]sometimes[/-] USUALLY not the facts, seas are [-]sometimes[/-] USUALLY exaggerated, etc.

I'm just sayin'! :blinking:

 

[flots am]

I think there should be a meeting of the minds between the captain and the customers. Ultimately its his boat and he's responsible for the people on it and at some point he needs to protect them from their own ignorance.

That's a much harder job than driving the boat and I don't think there's a boat captain (or DM or instructor) anywhere that can protect people from their own mistakes.

I dive in current all the time, but can tell you that if I got to the dive site and saw 5' waves, my butt would be planted on the seat. I have no illusions that I can re-board a boat that's flying up and down 5' in a heavy current.

People need to exercise their own common sense, especially in SCUBA. I've seen all sorts of people do incredibly dangerous things because "nobody stopped them".

flots.

 

[Jupiter31]

"Do you think the dive ops decision to anchor and allow people to dive on a wreck in 5' seas and a 3.5 knot surface current was a wise decision?"


I don't think that is a fair question to ask.

The dive operator just drives the boat, it is the divers who make the decision to dive or not. Whether conditions are "safe" or not depends on a lot of factors, and not just a yardstick measurement of wave height or a guestimate of the current.

I agree that its always the individual who has to make a decision on any dive.

However......

To cut to the chase, I have been on more charters than I can think of where the captain/DM - in essence the charter operator - cancelled the dive and we went to another site - often because he felt some on the boat would not be able to handle the conditions.

IndianValley, you have more power than the average single diver or couple - did you charter the boat; or at the least you had a majority of divers - or they knew you were a shop, and were a steady source of business (none of this is a negative BTW).

I'm just saying you have more say so than the average single diver does viv a vis sites, diving et al.

 

[Indian Valley Scuba]

I agree that its always the individual who has to make a decision on any dive.

IndianValley, you have more power than the average single diver or couple - did you charter the boat; or at the least you had a majority of divers - or they knew you were a shop, and were a steady source of business (none of this is a negative BTW).

I'm just saying you have more say so than the average single diver does viv a vis sites, diving et al.

Thank you, and perhaps my take on the whole situation is jaded in that regard. Without starting a pissing contest, we (the Indian Valley Scuba group) often dive in seas far greater than 5 ft, in currents that are ripping, and other conditions that need to be at least taken into consideration for the safety of all. And often an individual diver in the group will opt to sit out a dive that seems to be a bit too challenging, and it is important that the others respect that decision in a supportive and positive way.

On the other hand, we have had charters where the seas were nothing but whitecaps, and while some or even most of the divers on board sat it out, some of us were ok with diving in those conditions, and in fact did and will continue to.

Yes we often charter entire boats, and yes there is a bigger negotiating chip that comes with significant repeat business, but in the end it is important to live to dive another day. What might be way over one divers head with respect to conditions may be fairly mundane to another with appropriate experience.

Just use your judgement, and if unsure, be conservative. If you are OK, then let's dive!