Government Regulation

Please register or login

Welcome to ScubaBoard, the world's largest scuba diving community. Registration is not required to read the forums, but we encourage you to join. Joining has its benefits and enables you to participate in the discussions.

Benefits of registering include

  • Ability to post and comment on topics and discussions.
  • A Free photo gallery to share your dive photos with the world.
  • You can make this box go away

Joining is quick and easy. Log in or Register now!

Although I'm against regulation I can't see more robust swimming skills and fitness tests being such a bad idea.

True, I think everybody should have the ability to swim five miles continuous in under three hours, be on BMI and a body fat percentage under 10 and free dive to 100 feet. Surely all divers should be held to these requirements? I mean, after all, the government wants you to be healthy.

My point is, who's requirements, if they are mine, some people will not like them. Who gets to decide the standards, congress, the Federal Department of Underwater Activities Authority, FDUAA? It better not be me. Because I also think perfect buoyancy control should be required before diving in eco sensitive areas.

I am just an old meanie.

N
 
... somewhere in a mansion, an assistant has brought this man his breakfast and a printed copy of this thread... and this man is smiling and thinking..... "the NY courts ruined my plans for telling people how much soda pop they could drink... but maybe scuba diving needs my help?"

Michael-Bloomberg.jpg
 
I think scuba diving should be subject to exactly the same kinds of government regulations as apply to skiing, rock climbing, tennis, and running in marathons.
 
I don't think it is the role of the government to protect people from themselves. I do not support any government regulation unless they can show it is absolutely needed for reasons other than to protect someone from themselves.

Looked at with that view I don't think there should be any regulation. The current self regulation which is liability based is adequate.

One of my other hobbies is competitive shooting. That hobby / firearms in general are heavily regulated most of which is of no value just obstacles to deal with for those that want to follow the laws. I have tools for my sport that are fine in some states and highly illegal in others. Would be fun when you have to have a NY approved tank or a CA accepted cert card, or sorry inflator hose 2nds are not allowed in the FL keys, etc....
 
True, I think everybody should have the ability to swim five miles continuous in under three hours, be on BMI and a body fat percentage under 10 and free dive to 100 feet. Surely all divers should be held to these requirements? I mean, after all, the government wants you to be healthy.

If the government wants you to be healthy, some of us need more body fat than that. Women's ESSENTIAL body fat makes up about 12% of their body. Athletes typically have 12 to almost 20% body fat, fit normal people 20-25% and average women up to 30 before they are getting into the 'too fat' range.

So apparently your "healthy" diver regulations would require super fit anorexic women?
 
There may not be much money it it as revenues and voting goes,,, but remember OBAMA CARE was not made for divers. Violate a reg and no coverage. After all the stats say that divers are OLD and have TERMINAL ADDICTIONS/CONDITIONS THAT CAN NOT BE IMPROVED WITH TREATMENT. HMMMMM......




It will never happen.
There's not enough money in it for them.
They may as well start regulating surfing or scateboarding, or rock climbing.
What would they gain from regulating any of it?
 
Government regulation of dive activities is something I would stand behind. If private individuals, organizations, or businesses wouldn't, or couldn't, enforce rules and regulations, then the government should step in. I am well aware that the right thing to do almost never get done until the government steps in. For example, school segregation is wrong, but still, it took a ruling called Brown vs. Board of Education to end it.

I totally understand that there is a financial incentives for dive charters and dive masters to look the other way if the violations are minor (ex: touching wildlife, touching corals). If they look the other way, they would keep the customer happy, because letting the customers do whatever they want is good customer service (sarcasm). I am embarrassed to admit this, but this is based on personal experience. When I was diving with my extended family in Malaysia back in 2006, my uncle loudly admit that he touched coral and wildlife and my divemaster literally covered his eyes with his hand when he sees my uncle doing it...

Currently, I have this idea. I was reading the "How to piss off a divemaster?" thread and I am shocked by the abuses a divemaster receives. What if from now on, a divemaster will also have the responsibility to report safety violations or fisheries and habitat protection violation (ex: illegally harvesting sea cucumbers for BBQ). Thankfully, all divers on-board a charter would have signed a waiver, which included their contact information, address, and date of birth. A divemaster could simply make a photocopy of the waiver and attach a copy of the incident report and forward it to the appropriate government agency (I am still deciding on what government agency should be responsible for this). A couple days later (depending on the efficiency of the agency), the person suspected of breaking the rules will receive a call from said agency and be given a chance to defend himself. If it is determined that said individual is guilty, his licence will be taken away and he will be stopped from diving for a certain amount of time, or if the violation is very, very serious, banned for life. Due to the concept of judicial independence, the suspect can certainly fight the ruling in court.

This system, if implemented, will let divers know that what they did underwater will have consequences. The dive master may not be able to stop you now, but you will have to deal with the US government once you return home.

This system is not extreme at all and there are already precedence for this. For example, driving. If you sped while driving, you get points taken from you and your licence will be taken from you after a certain amount of point. You drink and drive and was caught, you have your licence taken away and you may go to jail. There is also a precedence for this in diving as well. If you look at PADI's QM department's QM Procedure Flow Chart, my system is inspired by it. The difference is that whereas PADI QM deals with Divemasters and above, my system deals with everyone who dive.

Unfortunately, this system will not work if the task of regulating and enforcing is given to a dive training organization (ex: PADI). The reason is that the relationship between training organization and us is still a service provider/ customer relationship and hence unequal. A diver can simply laugh at the training organization in the face and go to another organization. Now, if it is the government coming after them though, they won't be laughing.

I remember back in university, my American history professor once said, "Self-Regulation is always better than government regulation. Government regulation is almost always a lot harsher than self-regulation." Of course it would be best if training organization can also regulate and enforce rules, but as I mentioned above, the unequal service provider/ customer position makes regulating and enforcing hard.

People like you scare me.
 
I don't think it is the role of the government to protect people from themselves. I do not support any government regulation unless they can show it is absolutely needed for reasons other than to protect someone from themselves. .

Unfortunately, American society does not agree with you, as we have a long history of electing people who are supposed to be representatives of those whom elected them and they immediately stop representing them as soon as they get elected.

Elected officials have made it illegal for most Americans to not wear a seat belt. Killing yourself is also absurdly illegal. The list is a mile long of legislation that violates the idea of as long as you aren't hurting anyone but yourself.

When we elect someone the dingbat immediately has to start 'legislating' or in other words start creating legislation in order to prove they are 'working'. In 2012 alone over 40,000 new laws went into effect just at the state level. That's 110 new laws every single day!

The shear amount of government we have is ridiculous and only gets worse by people who believe that if a little government is good. then a lot of government must be great!

The IRS tax code is over 76,000 pages. To read it all, it would take an accountant an entire year if they could read 200 pages a day. Just this one item is so ridiculous that 10 experts on the tax code can argue on opinion on it's contents 10 different ways with no consensus as to a valid prediction of the result if you get audited. 76000 pages and no definitive answer to questions that the code represents the answers to. Stunning. Yet, we need more government?
 
If the government wants you to be healthy, some of us need more body fat than that. Women's ESSENTIAL body fat makes up about 12% of their body. Athletes typically have 12 to almost 20% body fat, fit normal people 20-25% and average women up to 30 before they are getting into the 'too fat' range.

So apparently your "healthy" diver regulations would require super fit anorexic women?

Did you read the entire thread? And, just as you argue with my fictional diver specifications, you would be unhappy equally so with anything from the government. Well, I used to believe that, now I realize, most people are actually sheeple.

And, yes, I think people, including women, should be on BMI. Let's make that a government requirement, I vote for it. And, I think they should make the entrances to fast food restaurants, no more than, uh, 12 inches wide. Oh, and no cola products, and, uh, no sugar, and on and on.

Read the entire thread and also, learn to read between the lines.

N
 
https://www.shearwater.com/products/peregrine/

Back
Top Bottom