duckman
Registered
Are there any harnesses out there that are made specificaly for PSD diving and carry some kind of standard?
Replies appreciated
Replies appreciated
Harnesses
- Thread starter duckman
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Yotsie
Contributor
You don't like the LGS harness?
That other thread that yotsie mentioned is all well and good if you're looking for a commercial diving harness or a climbing harness but they're unsuited for PSD IMO
That other thread that yotsie mentioned is all well and good if you're looking for a commercial diving harness or a climbing harness but they're unsuited for PSD IMO
Thanks for all the great info, the link was very informative.
Bridgediver, you are making an assumption here. I do like the LGS harness, but some members of our team have questioned the lack of a standard issued to it. Something I can respect, and as an instructor I have a duty to lok into the issue. The guys are OK with it's use in an open environment but not in current and under ice.
Duckman
Bridgediver, you are making an assumption here. I do like the LGS harness, but some members of our team have questioned the lack of a standard issued to it. Something I can respect, and as an instructor I have a duty to lok into the issue. The guys are OK with it's use in an open environment but not in current and under ice.
Duckman
gotcha!
I knew that you knew the LGS harness was made for PSD, hence the question. As far as standards (the CSA being the only PSD standard) the way I read it, almost any harness (chest style) would satisfy those requirements. We don't have any specifics as do the high angle/climbing harnesses do as far as I know.
If you do find something different, please share
mark
I knew that you knew the LGS harness was made for PSD, hence the question. As far as standards (the CSA being the only PSD standard) the way I read it, almost any harness (chest style) would satisfy those requirements. We don't have any specifics as do the high angle/climbing harnesses do as far as I know.
If you do find something different, please share
mark
Great style and a good harness. Go with them.
Gary D.
Gary D.
I authored the post that was referenced and I thought I would just offer up a few comments.
I agree that there is no standard or certification for a PSD diving harness unlike an OSAH or NFPA fall protection harness. This is troubling since to me these harnesses are a safety device and should fall under some sort of offical governance.
My quest to find something that is officially certified started with equipment that has been certified. Combined with the fact that the two chest harnesses I have dove with I have not been able to get them to fit correctly. They rotate on my body and the shoulder straps slide down my arms. I have tried adjusting them and had other "experts" try adjusting them as well. In addition the LGS harness uses velcro to secure the harness which I do not feel is safe. Maybe I am over reacting but its my life so I feel I am allowed this indulgence.
The CMC harness seems to have the best chance of working and it specifically mentions that it is designed for a water environment. I have never tried to swim with a full five point harness so I cannot comment on how it could impact or restrict leg movement. My plan is to purchase a harness that best seems to meet all of my needs and test it out. My hope is that a 5 point harness will allow me to adjust it and eliminate the current problems with a chest only harness and not restrict my swimming or increase my time to get dressed. Time will tell and I will post the results of my test.
Please pass along any information you find during your investigations.
Mark
I agree that there is no standard or certification for a PSD diving harness unlike an OSAH or NFPA fall protection harness. This is troubling since to me these harnesses are a safety device and should fall under some sort of offical governance.
My quest to find something that is officially certified started with equipment that has been certified. Combined with the fact that the two chest harnesses I have dove with I have not been able to get them to fit correctly. They rotate on my body and the shoulder straps slide down my arms. I have tried adjusting them and had other "experts" try adjusting them as well. In addition the LGS harness uses velcro to secure the harness which I do not feel is safe. Maybe I am over reacting but its my life so I feel I am allowed this indulgence.
The CMC harness seems to have the best chance of working and it specifically mentions that it is designed for a water environment. I have never tried to swim with a full five point harness so I cannot comment on how it could impact or restrict leg movement. My plan is to purchase a harness that best seems to meet all of my needs and test it out. My hope is that a 5 point harness will allow me to adjust it and eliminate the current problems with a chest only harness and not restrict my swimming or increase my time to get dressed. Time will tell and I will post the results of my test.
Please pass along any information you find during your investigations.
Mark
There sure are allot of "Marks" on here - that can only be a good thing
Mark -
I meant nothing by my comments here about your other thread - just my view but since you brought it up...
Much like climbing harnesses commercial diving harnesses need to be designed to take a load - a very heavy commercial diver and haul him up off the bottom and even maybe through the air. There is no such requirement in PSD. It is certainly ill advised to drag a PSD up from depth (go to him instead) but by diving neutral (or close to it) there isn't a significant load that the harness must take even if you do need to do this. We usually dive neutral or perhaps a few pounds neg unlike a commercial diver that may be extremely overweighted if you factor in tools and such. At most were looking at a basically neutral diver being dragged by a few knots of current (and even that requires significant training) anything more really is outside the realm of what we should be doing.
A 5 point harness will take longer to put on, restrict movement, restrict breathing (some) and most likely won't place the tether point where it needs to be for PSD (to maintain a good horizontal search position). I believe they would limit your effectiveness.
Commercial divers walk along the bottom; we swim - sort of...
I can't argue that they're any less safe (unless you see it as just another bit of gear for entanglements, but I don't) than a standard chest harness but I can't see how they would make a PSD any safer. A solution to a non-issue in my mind but please persuade me otherwise if you have a scenario in mind.
Of course I can't speak about how you can't get the chest harness to fit to your liking only that our team ranges in a wide assortment of sizes and we haven't had any issues. Thats a weird one...
I also agree wholeheartly that it boils down to what YOU are most comfortable with. Try it! Let us know how it works!
Mark -
I meant nothing by my comments here about your other thread - just my view but since you brought it up...
Much like climbing harnesses commercial diving harnesses need to be designed to take a load - a very heavy commercial diver and haul him up off the bottom and even maybe through the air. There is no such requirement in PSD. It is certainly ill advised to drag a PSD up from depth (go to him instead) but by diving neutral (or close to it) there isn't a significant load that the harness must take even if you do need to do this. We usually dive neutral or perhaps a few pounds neg unlike a commercial diver that may be extremely overweighted if you factor in tools and such. At most were looking at a basically neutral diver being dragged by a few knots of current (and even that requires significant training) anything more really is outside the realm of what we should be doing.
A 5 point harness will take longer to put on, restrict movement, restrict breathing (some) and most likely won't place the tether point where it needs to be for PSD (to maintain a good horizontal search position). I believe they would limit your effectiveness.
Commercial divers walk along the bottom; we swim - sort of...
I can't argue that they're any less safe (unless you see it as just another bit of gear for entanglements, but I don't) than a standard chest harness but I can't see how they would make a PSD any safer. A solution to a non-issue in my mind but please persuade me otherwise if you have a scenario in mind.
Of course I can't speak about how you can't get the chest harness to fit to your liking only that our team ranges in a wide assortment of sizes and we haven't had any issues. Thats a weird one...
I also agree wholeheartly that it boils down to what YOU are most comfortable with. Try it! Let us know how it works!
One thing for sure is that a 5 point WILL increase your suit up time. In many cases it will also place restrictions like Bridgediver listed as well as others.
One reaches a point where trying to be safe they actually make the situation more dangerous.
If you are so set on getting the best and strongest system possible there is one out there that has no seams at all and only one connecting point. It’s called a rope. Just wrap it around your body and clip or tie it off.
Keep the system simple and don’t try to overkill it. Good luck on finding one that fits like a top of the line tailored tux.
Gary D.
One reaches a point where trying to be safe they actually make the situation more dangerous.
If you are so set on getting the best and strongest system possible there is one out there that has no seams at all and only one connecting point. It’s called a rope. Just wrap it around your body and clip or tie it off.
Keep the system simple and don’t try to overkill it. Good luck on finding one that fits like a top of the line tailored tux.
Gary D.
Bridge,
I appreciate all your comments and I did not mean to suggest I was put off or offended by anything you said. I see this as a learning process and I will always be open to ideas and comments. I take everything said here very seriously and I am very grateful for everyone's input. I know how valuable the knowledge and experience is on this board and the last thing I would ever want to do is make someone feel like their input was not appreciated.
My LGS harness has two problems. One is that the shoulder straps have come off my shoulders and get around my arms. It is near impossible to fix this in the water. This usually occurs when I have my chest strap snug and it rides up my body and causes the shoulder straps to slack. When I had an "expert" adjust the harness they had me put a fist under the belly strap and told me I had it too tight. This then caused the harness to rotate around my chest causing akward imbalance in my diving position. I continue to dive and manage this as best I can but if there were something better out there I would love to use it.
Gary I have been in too many "safety" project gone horribly awry. I am a firm believer in KISS (Keep It Simple Stupid!!) I will try to keep this in mind when I attempt to find something better.
I agree with both Gary and Bridge that a 5 point harness could take more time to get into and could restrict movement and breathing but until I prove it to myself I will always wonder. Again no disrespect to anyone here it just my own OCD!!!:freak:
Mark "D." <----Bridge hope this helps
I appreciate all your comments and I did not mean to suggest I was put off or offended by anything you said. I see this as a learning process and I will always be open to ideas and comments. I take everything said here very seriously and I am very grateful for everyone's input. I know how valuable the knowledge and experience is on this board and the last thing I would ever want to do is make someone feel like their input was not appreciated.
My LGS harness has two problems. One is that the shoulder straps have come off my shoulders and get around my arms. It is near impossible to fix this in the water. This usually occurs when I have my chest strap snug and it rides up my body and causes the shoulder straps to slack. When I had an "expert" adjust the harness they had me put a fist under the belly strap and told me I had it too tight. This then caused the harness to rotate around my chest causing akward imbalance in my diving position. I continue to dive and manage this as best I can but if there were something better out there I would love to use it.
Gary I have been in too many "safety" project gone horribly awry. I am a firm believer in KISS (Keep It Simple Stupid!!) I will try to keep this in mind when I attempt to find something better.
I agree with both Gary and Bridge that a 5 point harness could take more time to get into and could restrict movement and breathing but until I prove it to myself I will always wonder. Again no disrespect to anyone here it just my own OCD!!!:freak:
Mark "D." <----Bridge hope this helps
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