Has SCUBA training gone too far?
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T.C.
Contributor
Yes, I do think there are some new divers who will think that. No dive op will ask to see your UW photography card before you fall off the boat with a camera. But if some new diver is lead by an unscrupulous instructor to believe he does need that specialty...
My question: Will they ban you from looking at the fish if you don't have a Fish ID specialty?
You know, one of the best classes I've taken since I learned to dive was a Pacific Northwest Marine ID class which is a distinctive specialty of the author, Laurel LaFever. I think I got a card for it but I really don't remember, and I have no idea where that card is.
Another incredible experience I had was a handful of weekends working with a high-end technical instructor. It was workshop stuff with the goal of improving, and no one was more surprised than I when we ended up with a Recreational Trimix card at the end of it.
Cards and instruction are different. Sometimes you need cards (says the woman who couldn't rent a dry suit in SoCal, after 500 or more dry dives, because she didn't have the card). Sometimes you don't. But if you are doing the kind of diving for which that instruction is valuable, the CLASS is always worthwhile, if it's a worthwhile class
. Look at GUE Fundamentals -- almost everybody who takes it says it was the best diving class they've ever had, and the card buys you absolutely nothing you didn't have before, unless you weren't Nitrox certified.
Another incredible experience I had was a handful of weekends working with a high-end technical instructor. It was workshop stuff with the goal of improving, and no one was more surprised than I when we ended up with a Recreational Trimix card at the end of it.
Cards and instruction are different. Sometimes you need cards (says the woman who couldn't rent a dry suit in SoCal, after 500 or more dry dives, because she didn't have the card). Sometimes you don't. But if you are doing the kind of diving for which that instruction is valuable, the CLASS is always worthwhile, if it's a worthwhile class
. Look at GUE Fundamentals -- almost everybody who takes it says it was the best diving class they've ever had, and the card buys you absolutely nothing you didn't have before, unless you weren't Nitrox certified.
Sometimes you don't. But if you are doing the kind of diving for which that instruction is valuable, the CLASS is always worthwhile, if it's a worthwhile class
The back of mine says something about a drysuit and doubles as well. So I guess I could rent a drysuit should I need to with it.
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T C raised a very good point and one I've had some students ask -- "I don't have a Night Diving card, can I do a Night Dive?". I'm always sad when a student raises that issue because, NO, you don't "need" to have taken a class to do "X" in diving (generally). But you DO need some experience to do "Y" type of diving and if it is an incremental step to this next type of thing, one probably doesn't "need" a class -- a mentor should work well or just some simple trial and error.
But how BIG a step? How much experience? How much risk?
As I wrote before, we ALL can benefit from additional training, experiences, etc. How we get that training or experience is the question, is it not?
But how BIG a step? How much experience? How much risk?
As I wrote before, we ALL can benefit from additional training, experiences, etc. How we get that training or experience is the question, is it not?
GUE-F "buys" you the pass to take GUE Tech 1 or Cave 1.
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Mike126
Contributor
I agree that the idea of a "cert" is probably not the right description of the learning activity. To me the cert are the classes where you have to learn skills to keep you safe or teach you special skills like rescue or CPR. The fish id or night diver is not a skill but more general education. A lot of the agencies treat certs like the Boy Scouts and badges. The education can be valuable but not worthy of calling in a cert.
I would be very interested in becoming a Master Advanced Zombie Diver Instructor.
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I would be very interested in becoming a Master Advanced Zombie Diver Instructor.
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aqua andi
what would the opsition of your ins co be if you died engaging inf activities not trained for. IE dive a wreck your cojvered till you penitrate. Or victom to a flooded dry suit. not trying to stir the pot just postulating. I think dan ins only covers you for incidents you are trained for. I will however agree that there are too many certs. and i fully agree with you about things like photo. There is definately a busines model in play.
There is another aspect, and that is " Lets move the master diver program. so you need first responder and aow rescue "AND 2-3 OTHER SPECIALITYS" If you want the master card you will l have to give us another 200$ for the BS specialities. We will make them easy and attach us with minimal liability but haul in the revenues. One day they will have clearing your mask and putting on booties and turning on air for the other 3. but who cares 50 for each class and 30 for the card and no chance of gettng sued adn the stockholders are happy. Sarcastic perhaps but it is a possible motive. I was dissappointed in my master card because of the allowable specialities. I would think that a reasonable manditory list would be NITROX NIGHT DEEP NAVIGATION BOUYANCY RESCUE. After all the next step is DM. Just my opinion.
regards
what would the opsition of your ins co be if you died engaging inf activities not trained for. IE dive a wreck your cojvered till you penitrate. Or victom to a flooded dry suit. not trying to stir the pot just postulating. I think dan ins only covers you for incidents you are trained for. I will however agree that there are too many certs. and i fully agree with you about things like photo. There is definately a busines model in play.
There is another aspect, and that is " Lets move the master diver program. so you need first responder and aow rescue "AND 2-3 OTHER SPECIALITYS" If you want the master card you will l have to give us another 200$ for the BS specialities. We will make them easy and attach us with minimal liability but haul in the revenues. One day they will have clearing your mask and putting on booties and turning on air for the other 3. but who cares 50 for each class and 30 for the card and no chance of gettng sued adn the stockholders are happy. Sarcastic perhaps but it is a possible motive. I was dissappointed in my master card because of the allowable specialities. I would think that a reasonable manditory list would be NITROX NIGHT DEEP NAVIGATION BOUYANCY RESCUE. After all the next step is DM. Just my opinion.
regards
Taking a class from a good instructor is always a good way if you want to learn something. My problem with the whole thing is when I need a nitrox card to use nitrox, a drysuit card to rent a drysuit, an AOW card to dive below 60 feet and so on. The card doesn't mean you have learned anything and the lack of a card doesn't mean you are not good at it. I kind of like the dive operations in Mexico. They check you out while you set up your equipment, they watch you in the water, and when they know you can dive they take you diving.
I always remember the couple diving with us who had to tell us they were rescue divers. Must have been self rescue cause shortly after that she ran out of air at 100' after about 10 minutes of bottom time and did an emergency ascent.
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