How many dives to be a PADI scuba instructor?

[RJP]

Not necessarily, but I also feel having more experience with a wide array of equipment makes for a better experience for the student.

And if the two instructor owned their own gear they'd only have experience with one set of gear.

So which is it?

Are they deficient instructors for not owning their own gear (bad) but using the shop's wide array of gear (good)?

Or

Would they be deficient instructors for owning their own gear (good) but not using a wide array of gear (bad)?

 

[Bob DBF]

1. Being a good instructor is not about how well you can dive... it's about how well you can teach.

I think there should be a progression of dives, time and experience to go from diver to DM and from DM to instructor, Since that is not the case, the important part of being an instructor is to instruct well.

In my job, I had a lot of technical training classes. The instructors were excellent at training on the gear, however I would not want them working with me without some OJT and experience. The "street smarts" they had before, in the field, as techs was now secondary to finding a way to educate whoever the people were in front of him.

Experience in an important thing… but it’s not the only thing.

Experience in an important thing… as long as it doesn't get in the way of your job.




Bob
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“I am always ready to learn although I do not always like being taught.”
― Winston Churchill

 

[GrimSleeper]

Ten years ago, pretty much by accident, I became an instructor with the grand total of 140 logged dives, all done in benign tropical conditions. 4000-odd dives later, from my lofty pillar of dive-godliness, I look back and am amazed they let me in the water, let alone teach people to dive.

Here's the thing, though. I think I'm probably an ok instructor - not Earth-shatteringly great, but competent, good on the technical stuff - and a very competent diver. Ten years ago, in all honesty, while I wasn't anywhere near as strong a diver, I was probably a better instructor than I am now, certainly at OW level. I had an enthusiasm for teaching that might, er, be less obvious now...

Entry-level diving in tropical conditions (which is what the vast majority of new divers want) isn't rocket surgery, and the agencies have good enough programmes in place that a conscientious instructor with an enthusiasm for teaching can do a good job. You need enough experience to know whether a student's doing things properly and you need to be comfortable enough in the water that you can deal with the minor emergencies of an Open Water course without being too stretched in terms of your own dive skills. And that's about it.

After ten years in SE Asia and the South Pacific I wouldn't presume to teach anyone wreck diving in the North Atlantic without building up some solid experience in those conditions, but there's a breed of instructor out there who does that. For most other folks, the zero-to-hero instructor - as long as they have the teaching ability - almost certainly has sufficient skill and experience to get them started on diving.

Whether the world needs another 100,000 SCUBA instructors (or whatever the number is) being produced annually, now, that's a whole other question...

 

[WhiteSands]

Instead of having number of dives qualifiying a candidate for instructor exam, instead there should be a qualification of diver skill before a person can even undergo instructor training.

I feel that as with many other things, GUE has it right. An instructor candidate must have a minimum of Fundies with Tech Pass rating to start, and I believe to be certified as an instructor you need a minimum of Tech 1 pass, among other things of course. This ensures the instructor has a certain standard in terms of in-water diving skill, and also has knowledge above and beyond what he is certified to teach.

I am sure there are other evaluations based on knowledge of materials, classroom control, teaching skills etc that are evaluated but these 2 are relevant to the OP's question.

 

[RJP]

Instead of having number of dives qualifiying a candidate for instructor exam, instead there should be a qualification of diver skill before a person can even undergo instructor training.

Great idea. If only there was some sort of step that preceded being an instructor... where a divers knowledge and skill were evaluated. If only there was something like that.

 

[TMHeimer]

I would probably go with more than 100 dives being required. How many more I don't know, and of course there are total hours UW to consider. Of course experience counts, thus someone with more dives than another would more LIKELY be a better DIVER. Instructors are like school teachers in that some are "naturals" who command the attention of students while others can be good too, but have to work at it. Others suck. The duties of a DM aren't really that varied from one class to another, though working for different instructors means doing some things different. Generally it would seem to me you wouldn't need years of DMing to make a good instructor. But here too of course, the more experience as a DM the better. I agree that as long as an instructor intends to teach in one place he/she must only know the ins and outs of that place (aside from all the general stuff all should know, of course).

 

[NC Air Hog]

While I am not one for "taking sides" on an issue, I would agree with RJP's thought in asking how many dies is enough. The definition of a "dive" is typically 20 minutes in the water from everything I have understood to this point. So what prevents individuals from hanging on a line for 20 minutes at a time or diving for an hour and calling it three dives? There are all types of ways to cheat the system put in place and many blame the standards and the way they are written. I think that personal responsibility has to play a role. Deep down, everyone knows if they should or should not instruct even if they meet all of the requirements. There will never be a perfect answer.

If we look at it from another perspective, we could ask what type of person would want to learn from the "barely got by" instructor. It is kind of like Doctor shopping. Eventually you will find a dive instructor that will cert you in almost anything you want if you look hard enough. That just shouldn't be the way instruction occurs though.

My thought is that there is no number of dives. I can write up a logbook right now that makes me look like a diving maniac. I have met those with 200 dives that look like they have barely gotten wet and those who have 20 dives and look great. I am still working on my own skills and think that we all need to keep learning from each other. Diving is supposed to be fun. If you can make money doing it through instructing.... BONUS!

 

[TSandM]

RJP, I don't think the divemaster class evaluates diving skills much at all. It evaluates your ability to DEMONSTRATE skills -- but you can do them all sitting on the bottom of the pool, if the instructor running the DM class is okay with that. I have watched a lot of DM candidates working with instructors through our shop, and that is PRECISELY how the "demonstration quality" skills have been done. Except for the Buddha hover, of course, which is such a useful test of someone's diving ability.

Personally, I think anybody who wants to teach OW should be able to manage the equivalent of a rec pass from Fundies -- in other words, should be able to demonstrate good buoyancy control and good trim while solidly task-loaded, and should be able to perform all the basic skills in a horizontal and neutral position.

 

[RJP]

RJP, I don't think the divemaster class evaluates diving skills much at all. It evaluates your ability to DEMONSTRATE skills -- but you can do them all sitting on the bottom of the pool, if the instructor running the DM class is okay with that. I have watched a lot of DM candidates working with instructors through our shop, and that is PRECISELY how the "demonstration quality" skills have been done. Except for the Buddha hover, of course, which is such a useful test of someone's diving ability.

Personally, I think anybody who wants to teach OW should be able to manage the equivalent of a rec pass from Fundies -- in other words, should be able to demonstrate good buoyancy control and good trim while solidly task-loaded, and should be able to perform all the basic skills in a horizontal and neutral position.

Indeed, the quality of the DM coming out of the program is a function of the quality of the program itself. Guess I was spoiled in that the course director running my DM program, was also one of my tech instructors... sort of a DirM program.

 

[Steve_C]

I think a variety of experience is important.

I was certified in a quarry. Would I want an instructor with only quarry dives. Absolutely not. I, like some other folks, dive when I travel. Shortly after certification I was boat diving in Florida, then diving off NC, then as I traveled, Greece, Vancouver, Calif, Hawaii, (and of course the Keys and other reef diving). I think instructors should provide some guidance on the variety of diving out there since an OW card allows you to do an OW dive anywhere with no overhead.

I received a lot of helpful guidance by my OW instructor during OW and the first couple of certs (nav, buoy, AOW; all done in the quarry) about diving in other locations under different conditions.

(My instructor had several thousand dives in many environments and was qualified to teach through some of the tech levels in a couple of agencies)