flots am
Contributor
- Messages
- 3,226
- Reaction score
- 1,859
- # of dives
- I just don't log dives
How those idiots (us) run out of air
- Thread starter billt4sf
- Start date
Please register or login
Welcome to ScubaBoard, the world's largest scuba diving community. Registration is not required to read the forums, but we encourage you to join. Joining has its benefits and enables you to participate in the discussions.
Benefits of registering include
- Ability to post and comment on topics and discussions.
- A Free photo gallery to share your dive photos with the world.
- You can make this box go away
I sense a few more pages coming... You're good at this Bill!
On point 1, it sounds like you did the right thing and chose a dive site that you were comfortable with, rather than having it chosen for you.
On point 2, I see your point and have seen it locally. These dive ops dive these sites all the time, so it's no big deal to them. For those that have never been to them, we'd like to know a little more about them rather than being herded like cows
. At the end of the day, we have to be responsible for choosing where and when we dive and who we dive with. From what I've seen, a lot of the boats have it already planned on where they are going and it's up to the captain to change those plans if the conditions are right. In my limited experience, I've already seen this happen. In fact it was on my very first drift dive, we had 4-6 ft seas, so the capt took us to closer reefs rather than the 1 hour planned trip.
Continuing on point 2, every ow diver should know how to orally inflate a BCD. To me, it sounds like you could have used a refresh class before you started the more advanced dives. All these questions could have come up. I don't know that I want to be interviewed every time I dive, but nothing stops you from sparking up conversation with the dive op to get recommendations for safety. If it's a 60+ ft dive, should they be asking for an AOW? There's a whole thread on that question somewhere.
Bill, I hope you had some great dives, you need to give us some positive dive reports about what you saw and experienced.
On point 1, it sounds like you did the right thing and chose a dive site that you were comfortable with, rather than having it chosen for you.
On point 2, I see your point and have seen it locally. These dive ops dive these sites all the time, so it's no big deal to them. For those that have never been to them, we'd like to know a little more about them rather than being herded like cows
. At the end of the day, we have to be responsible for choosing where and when we dive and who we dive with. From what I've seen, a lot of the boats have it already planned on where they are going and it's up to the captain to change those plans if the conditions are right. In my limited experience, I've already seen this happen. In fact it was on my very first drift dive, we had 4-6 ft seas, so the capt took us to closer reefs rather than the 1 hour planned trip.Continuing on point 2, every ow diver should know how to orally inflate a BCD. To me, it sounds like you could have used a refresh class before you started the more advanced dives. All these questions could have come up. I don't know that I want to be interviewed every time I dive, but nothing stops you from sparking up conversation with the dive op to get recommendations for safety. If it's a 60+ ft dive, should they be asking for an AOW? There's a whole thread on that question somewhere.
Bill, I hope you had some great dives, you need to give us some positive dive reports about what you saw and experienced.
Stoo
Contributor
- Messages
- 3,505
- Reaction score
- 3,804
- # of dives
- 5000 - ∞
I've only managed to run out of air once in 39 years/5000 dives... and it's pretty interesting when it happens. On a "two tank" charter in Utila, the dive staff insisted on changing our tanks over between dives. On our forth day, second dive, I was happily swimming along snapping pics, when I took a breath, and that was "it"! (The new fangled, high-performance regulators really don't give much warning!). I pondered a free ascent (I was in 90' and have done this many times "playing") but since I was pretty bubbled up after several days of diving, I decided to get friendly with my wife-buddy! She was about 20 feet away, also snapping pics. I popped her octo off of her necklace with a minimum of fuss (she was a pretty new diver at that point.) We packed up our cameras, and made a normal ascent with safety stop and SMB deployed.
What was really funny about all of this was that our DM (the one who didn't change the tank) came over and gave a two palms up "WTF?" signal. When I indicated I was out of air, he pointed at me and said "You???", started laughing and swam away... Awesome! (He and I had dove together before and he new we were quite capable of managing the situation. He was horrified to learn WHY I had run out and we both agreed that it was good it was my tank that was forgotten and not someone else's that wasn't changed over. He bought more than a few beers that night!)
Obviously this was 100% my fault, and it was the last time I relied on the familiar SOUND of a pressuring system to "confirm" by tank was full. Very much a "stroke" error on my part...
What was really funny about all of this was that our DM (the one who didn't change the tank) came over and gave a two palms up "WTF?" signal. When I indicated I was out of air, he pointed at me and said "You???", started laughing and swam away... Awesome!
(He and I had dove together before and he new we were quite capable of managing the situation. He was horrified to learn WHY I had run out and we both agreed that it was good it was my tank that was forgotten and not someone else's that wasn't changed over. He bought more than a few beers that night!)Obviously this was 100% my fault, and it was the last time I relied on the familiar SOUND of a pressuring system to "confirm" by tank was full. Very much a "stroke" error on my part...
captain
Contributor
I've only managed to run out of air once in 39 years/5000 dives... and it's pretty interesting when it happens. On a "two tank" charter in Utila, the dive staff insisted on changing our tanks over between dives. On our forth day, second dive, I was happily swimming along snapping pics, when I took a breath, and that was "it"! (The new fangled, high-performance regulators really don't give much warning!). I pondered a free ascent (I was in 90' and have done this many times "playing") but since I was pretty bubbled up after several days of diving, I decided to get friendly with my wife-buddy! She was about 20 feet away, also snapping pics. I popped her octo off of her necklace with a minimum of fuss (she was a pretty new diver at that point.) We packed up our cameras, and made a normal ascent with safety stop and SMB deployed.
What was really funny about all of this was that our DM (the one who didn't change the tank) came over and gave a two palms up "WTF?" signal. When I indicated I was out of air, he pointed at me and said "You???", started laughing and swam away... Awesome!
Obviously this was 100% my fault, and it was the last time I relied on the familiar SOUND of a pressuring system to "confirm" by tank was full. Very much a "stroke" error on my part...
I refuse to let DM's touch my gear and being it is usually double hose vintage gear they don't have a problem with that.
phoenix31tt
Contributor
there are multiple vies to this:
1. These guys dive these sites maybe on a daily basis, so to many of them in their experience its good to go for the majority of the divers especial when you have a certain number of dives
2. Most dive ops have no serious incidents so as far as they're concerend what they are doing now is fine... spending extra time to pull information from customers may not be helpful.. especially when the general feeling is that people lie, especially about their confidence in the water... not everybody would be like you.. in fact most wont... some may even get pissed if they're being grilled by a dive op that they paid their hard earned money to dive with... i've seen that happen
3. And as goes common theme i've stuck with.... you are responsible for your safety... the same way you chose not to dive Saba and the Speigel Grove... if you want to talk to the dive shop about details.. get to the shop early and you engage the staff in that kind of conversation... don't hope for them to do it... they do what they do everyday without incident why should they change that approach? it certainly doesn't benefit them...
i don't have enough dives to do that yet
... but on my last trip they would insist on changing our tanks... but everytime they would leave the air off... so obviously on my gear up i would turn it back on... then right after donning gear the guy who switched the tanks (he wasn't diving) would pass around and turn on everybody's air...needless to say after everytime he touched the rig, i would re-check my air supply an insist that my wife do the same
I've had the skipper turn and turn and turn my Wireless transmitter for my computer thinking he was turning the valve open,took a few seconds for me to realize what he was doing and correct him
IME it's best to go to the diving center at the end of the diving day- there should be someone available to talk to you. A diving center is a business like any other and normally it is run to a routine/schedule. Some 'front house staff' are fairly clueless when it comes to diving so it makes sense to talk directly to the operators. Sometimes those operators are still filling tanks at 8pm!
Paperwork may be available via email to cut down on time- ask.
I welcome questions via email- it gives Jude and I more preparation time to accomodate different divers and their skills/expectations. Some questions are pretty daft ie. "I know it's impossible to predict, but how will the weather be on May 12, 2015", but others are succinct and a decent level of understanding can be met this way.
If you're on a 'diving vacation', best prepare yourself in advance. If you're diving while on vacation, then there is time to chat.
Paperwork may be available via email to cut down on time- ask.
I welcome questions via email- it gives Jude and I more preparation time to accomodate different divers and their skills/expectations. Some questions are pretty daft ie. "I know it's impossible to predict, but how will the weather be on May 12, 2015", but others are succinct and a decent level of understanding can be met this way.
If you're on a 'diving vacation', best prepare yourself in advance. If you're diving while on vacation, then there is time to chat.
I suspect that dive shops have learned, over time, that not many people will either be honest or can make an accurate assessment of their own diving skills. I know, with horses, that EVERYBODY who wants to ride them has "ridden a lot", is "very comfortable on a horse", and wants to go faster, longer than is safe.
Look at the number of people who thought they were perfectly adequate divers, who have Fundies slap them in the face.
In addition to the financial pressure to get people out on dives, and the fact that most of the trouble people get themselves into CAN be salvaged, there is the feeling that a pre-dive assessment is futile.
Look at the number of people who thought they were perfectly adequate divers, who have Fundies slap them in the face.
In addition to the financial pressure to get people out on dives, and the fact that most of the trouble people get themselves into CAN be salvaged, there is the feeling that a pre-dive assessment is futile.
You absolutely have enough dives to do that. From the moment you finish OW (and arguably before) you have every right in the world to keep other people's hands off your gear. Anyone who says you don't have that right should be avoided like the plague. How you choose to exercise your right is an entirely different matter.i don't have enough dives to do that yet
needless to say after everytime he touched the rig, i would re-check my air supply an insist that my wife do the same
I've never allowed anyone to set up my gear. I don't mind them double checking me but I always make sure they didn't change anything. They have a job to do too, but it doesn't have to involve actually putting my kit together. They can lug tanks to and from, but I'll connect them. I'll turn on my gas, thank you very much. So far I've never had any crew members complain though some definitely watched to make sure I was doing everything right. I'm okay with that too.
Similar threads
