I'm the Pariah again

[dumpsterDiver]

He did????

I thought he and his buddy lost each other. He kept his head, followed proper safety procedures, which was circling underwater for a minute, then he surfaced and waved at the boat for help. Then at that point Matt was faced with what everybody who is actually in a situation instead of reading from a book has to face and that is dealing with the unique circumstances that every incident will have and making decisions on the fly. Matt isn't an EMT, a police offer, and dive instructor or anybody else with training and working professionally every day dealing with emergencies. He's just a guy on a dive that suddenly took a turn and he's doing his best to cope and deal with it as he can.

Meanwhile, his douche bag dive buddy is sitting on the boat watching it all unfold, watching the captain hailing Mark, not opening his pussy mouth for an instant to step in and tell the captain, Marks probably looking for me, since we got separated and I like a A-hole just abandoned him, swam to the boat and never said a single solitary word about me losing my buddy to anybody while Mark for all I know was trapped underwater dying.

The only thing different you should have done Mark beside discussing more things with your instant buddy prior to the dive, was to stop that captain in the middle of his 'lesson' and explained to everyone on the boat, that your dive buddy abandoned you at the end of the dive and you were dealing with a lost buddy scenario the best you could and put the blame on your jerk of a dive buddy where it fully belongs. If the captain didn't like that you should have just told him to go do what he's paid to do, drive the boat and shut up.

You haven't spent a lot of time offshore have you? LOL...

 

[EastEndDiver]

I would like to hear the Captains and buddies side of the story.

Here is something from another post of Matts that complains about things BUT in post 66 ,of the linked below thread, another diver who was there chimes in with a much different account of events ,see for yourself :

http://www.scubaboard.com/forums/ba...onsibility-your-own-safety-7.html#post6405891

 

[Mike]

I have a 100 ton license.

If you are so knowledgeable with your wealth of diving experience

You are truly a walking God among us mere mortals.

I'm just king of amazed how you're so fixated on the point of a diver "refusing" to signal a captain. I believe the choice of your words -- "refusing" demonstrates your frame of mind in this.

In reality Matt didn't 'refuse' to signal the captain, Matt was mentally trying to figure out how best to help his missing dive buddy. He was confused if giving the OK signal would help or harm the situation. Instead of acknowledgement of this, you focus on what you label as his 'refusal'. How far away is describing Matt's actions of 'refusal' to calling them disobeying, or insubordinate? It's a dang dive boat not a navy frigate. Matt's a paying customer on a dive boat, not a seaman refusing a direct order from an officer.

This captain and yourself, being as advanced in accomplishments and dives as you are should take a little pity on a poor diver with 20 dives and perhaps show a little understanding in the circumstances rather than looking to keel haul the poor guy.

 

[Hawkwood]

Do we really need all the histrionics and chest beating?

I am going to comment on the surface issue that arose.

The potential problem with not giving an OK, or failing to signal to the boat is: how they are going to respond to not receiving that OK or signal? If there is no OK or no signal, they will respond as if to a distressed diver on the surface - the diver not giving the OK. How will that happen? Possibly with a rescue swimmer not in dive gear - just mask, snorkel, and fins. If it turned out that the diver on surface was OK, but the issue was a missing buddy, there is now a longer delay getting someone out here in dive gear to look for the buddy.

Unless briefed otherwise, I have understood there are three signals you can give to give the boat:

I am OK - one handed or two handed;
I am OK but need to be picked up - fist held motionless over the head; and
I am in distress and need immediate help - extended arm waving back and forth.

Once it's established to the boat that "I am Okay", then you would have to move onto to informing them of the "missing" buddy. Going back to Rescue Class - you now have to give them the information of what last transpired.

One popular Rescue Class "scenario" was exactly what happened to Matt - the missing buddy who turns out to be back on the shore.

 

[jonnythan]

It's not that he failed to specifically give the OK sign.

It's that he completely failed to effectively communicate anything whatsoever. The captain was asking for information in an increasingly urgent way, and the OP failed to respond in anything that resembled a constructive manner.

 

[markmantei]

I'll use my better judgement here and steer clear of some of the egos.

Matt, when you did your buddy search did you remember to look up as well as around and below? If not it is possible, depending on the vis, that you would have located your buddy swimming above you toward the boat, negating the lost buddy situation altogether.

Remember we are operating in a three dimensional enviroment.

 

[drydiver]

I can relate to several of your sentiments as well as to the others involved. As a new diver I remember when a missing buddy seemed like an emergency. My first high current situation was unnerving because I worried whether I would make it back to the boat AT ALL. (It was a bad tender drop and we were finning against the current the entire dive) I remember when I surfaced looking for a boat that somehow was ridiculously far away. It seems that both buddies were stressed even before the separation if they were already looking for crevices in which to take a break from the current. At that point, with both knowing the boat is 2 football fields away, it is understandable how things could go down hill from there with insta buddies. I remember being told as a new diver our scope of awareness was mostly on ourselves, as we became more skilled and comfortable, our buddy awareness skills increases and finally our overall situational awareness improves, if we are lucky. I distinctly recall those phases in my awareness and acknowledge that they can still shift (ie resort back to alllll me) given the right circumstances.

On the flip side, I have been on boats where a worried diver boards without their buddy. All the divers and I am sure the staff's heart, skips a beat. Diver surfaces without ok sign, more skipped heart beats and we are now looking at who's got the most gear on and asking how much gas they have. And whomever that is, is usually will to put themselves in jeopardy to rescue a diver in distress. Usually the only equipment the DM is sporting is a pair of binoculars...

I remember making mistakes and being on the receiving end of a tongue lashing and being with someone else who made mistakes and giving it. In both those cases, although harsh sounding at the time, they were delivered with caring intent, albeit adrenaline filled. Those need to be taken for what they are: displays of concern to be understood and quickly forgiven.

 

[tyesai]

Not that it matters but I think Matt did the best he could with the knowledge he had. To some he might be overly concerned but it is better to air on the side of caution in my opinion, AND it is always easy to second guess someone after the fact. I tend to agree that the boat operator was the one over re-acting. If a boat operator can't consider that the dude was doing the best he can with his limited experience and gets all pissy about possibly having someone get wet over an honest mistake then I'd say **** him and his apology. I'd be just as "through" as Matt. I take my ball / money and go home.

 

[dumpsterDiver]

You are truly a walking God among us mere mortals.

I'm just king of amazed how you're so fixated on the point of a diver "refusing" to signal a captain. I believe the choice of your words -- "refusing" demonstrates your frame of mind in this.

In reality Matt didn't 'refuse' to signal the captain, Matt was mentally trying to figure out how best to help his missing dive buddy. He was confused if giving the OK signal would help or harm the situation. Instead of acknowledgement of this, you focus on what you label as his 'refusal'. How far away is describing Matt's actions of 'refusal' to calling them disobeying, or insubordinate? It's a dang dive boat not a navy frigate. Matt's a paying customer on a dive boat, not a seaman refusing a direct order from an officer.

This captain and yourself, being as advanced in accomplishments and dives as you are should take a little pity on a poor diver with 20 dives and perhaps show a little understanding in the circumstances rather than looking to keel haul the poor guy.

Seriously, have you been offshore at all? One of the things I explain to my children when we go offshore is that it is DANGEROUS... Even when they were 5 they knew this. When I give them a direction, they are EXPECTED to do it immediately and not ask why. Same goes for adults on a dive boat....when the captain gives an order (or direction) it is generally very important that you DO IT and then if you don't understand why... then maybe ask afterward. Unless the order sounds completely unsafe or crazy, then you follow directions.... I doesn't matter one damn bit that you paid for a spot on a charter or that you feel that the captain is essentially a "customer service representative"..

I remember years ago, I took some adult students out on a boat for a check out dive. 35 ft boat.... The capt told everyone to stay away from the sides of the boat while he pulled into the dock. One of my students was way too comfortable after his first 2 ocean dives and had his hand wrapped over the side of the boat. I happened to look down, notice his hand position and barked at him "move your hand"..(it was not a request)..He immediately snatched his hand in as the side of the boat crunched into the pilling.. His hand would have been destroyed if he had hesitated for even an instant or if I had "been polite".

There are a lot of captains that are egotistical jerks, but once you step onto THEIR BOAT, you damn well better be prepared to follow THEIR RULES. You can be pissed about what goes on, you can demand a refund when you get to shore... you might even have a man to man talk with the captain (if you don't have a "pussy mouth") when you reach the dock... but you really do need to respect the authority of the capt. while you are on his boat.

I don't get the impression that you understand this concept.

 

[karlimmergut]

Imagine that every customer on the boat was your mother. I am sure you would figure out a way to effectively deliver a message to your mother even in an emergency situation without being disrespectful, or you would simply apologize afterwards. I suspect that you would not say to your mother "I am through with you", or ask her the same questions three times in a row as if she were retarded. A little bit of imagination should suffice to appreciate the thin line between being rude, and speaking in a decisive and even commanding, but respectful manner in an emergency. Fortunately, in this case the captain did realize his mistake, and all was well...