Implementing LANC on newer Sony camcorders with 10-pin AV connectors?

[drbill]

Hi Bill,
Don't recall whether you are a pc or Mac person but not many, if any, NLEs will work natively with any form of the AVCHD codec. You should first transcode the footage to a codec that will work in your NLE. I use MPEG Streamclip, which is free and bug free as well, anytime I have a client shooting in AVCHD. I import the clips to Mpeg Streamclip and transcode them to Pro Res for editing in FCP.
Aside from all that, what are your impressions of the CX550 and what housing are you using for it? How easy is it to WB?
Steve

PC... I can transcode the AVCHD to MPEG-2 for Premiere or edit it natively in Vegas, so the footage itself is no longer posing any problem... just the control protocol.

 

[drbill]

These cables that work dont have any chips in them do they. Arent we talking about the wiring is correct for a specific camera? (mumble resistors and pins ?) in the end, the lanc signal must exit a working cable still as still conforming to the "lanc-standard" or existing wired remotes wont work with the new camera, and you would be force to buy a new wire-remote for every new camera.

I thought the LANC protocol was pretty standard. I've used six prior models of Sony camcorders in the same housing, all using the same LANC control cable (2.5mm male plug). This is the first one that has not worked.

 

[diversteve]

Interesting suggestion... it might work.

Except that in theory that's not possible - HDMI to Composite Cable - NOT - HDMI TO COMPOSITE ADAPTER

This HDMI to Composite Cable doesn't exist because:

1. HDMI is digital with pulses and Composite is analog with waveforms so an HDMI to Composite Cable won't work
2. HDMI has 19 pins and Composite + audio has only 3 so an HDMI to Composite Cable won't work
3. HDMI has the HDCP copy protection signal whereas there is no component equivalent so an HDMI to Composite Cable won't work
4. A cable is a passive device made up of 2 connectors, solder and wires. It cannot convert one digital signal into another analog signal so an HDMI to Composite Cable won't work

Don't buy an HDMI to Composite Cable from anyone as it doesn't work!

I know they sell them but even this ad for one has skeptical comments at the bottom. (Does it really work?)
DealExtreme: $13.24 HDMI to VGA + Composite RCA Audio Video Cable (1.5M-Length)

 

[gracet]

Based in the internet research and my 4 cameras spanning 15 years, It appears the protocol is very stable as such commands such as record, power off focus, as such those command codes have not changed. But new commands such as mode or photo or more zoom speeds are added over the years. Given that there is room for 512 commands to the camera there should be enough space for awhile. Thus as sony new camera engineer uses the same codes as already in common use for common buttons there is compatablity. He is allowed to add new command to currently unused codes. Ive only seen only once electrical specification for it. And my great interest in what is in the 10pin, i dont have one to play with yet, assuming the same spec is presented as through the cable to the 2.5mm plug. There are 3 wires, ground , power, and the lanc signal. The signal is bidirectional on one wire. Avhieved using timing pulses from the camera, the remote must get in sync with the timing and then send a two byte command while in camera exact bit sync. So a laundry listis , the cable failed to pass the power (if remote is not self powered), failed to pass the lanc, the camera is not sending the those, or the bit 0 signal level is just too different . A quick check is to use a 2.5mm cable break out and put a scope on it. One weired example i saw on the first generation topdawg is that when the hc9 was plugged in, the housing sent utter gargage codes for focus , yet good codes for power off, record, zoom,, and focus for earier cameras, this suggested some sort of discision choice in the housing based on camera lanc data but camera (too new for a lookup table?). Certainly not really nessary since the focus command hasnt changed in cameras ive seen.

 

[gracet]

My camera is the hc9 and it also has the 10pin connector. (and the 2.5mm lanc jack) I obtained cable J-6082-535-A which provides lanc and composite video at the same time to the 10pin on the camera. I used the meter to check for the resistor and i did see it. Then i tried it inside my top-dawg housing, and it did work. All the buttons work while tv output was working. I also have a lanc wired remote (drm-1) , it also works with this cable. I guess the next step is to try this cable with the 550 or ? 560 or what ever is in the store.

 

[drbill]

Just for clarification, my HC-7 with the 10-pin port works fine in my Top Dawg. To resolve the problem with my Sony CX550V, I decided it was time to do my part and stimulate the economy so I traded one of my Top Dawgs in on a new L&M Stingray G2 which, once I got it figured out, works great with my CX550V. Now I'm considered upgrading my video lights as well... and hoping I don't live to age 95 on what I have left for retirement!

 

[sharksdelight]

What lights are you currently using now?
Steve

 

[drbill]

Currently using NiteRider dual 10w HID lights... great for night dives but less useful during the day due to hot spots. Switching to LEDs as soon as I rob the local bank again.

 

[gracet]

Ok i made to bestbuy , they dont have the cx550 but they did have the cx560 and cx350 and i did verify the behavour as found by drbill.
1. if the 10pin cable is not a lanc cable, you can get composite video output from the camera.
2. if the 10pin cable is the lanc cable version, you cannot get the composite video output from the camera but the lanc control does work. Unplugging the lanc controller has not effect to the video out absence.


Also i tried this on the sx85 and sx65 (non hd sony camcorders ) and this problem disappears. The lanc 10pin cable does work the camera with both video and lanc at the same time.

I practiced with the cx560 IR remote control. You can get to, (it appears) all of the menu options, including the white balance button.

So supports a design theory solution using a dance of lanc and IR controllers (on one board) , to get done what you need. It is assumed that the cable presence of the 100k on two pins of the 10pin is telling the camera to turn off videoout from the camera. Then the lanc controller would also have to control the the 100k pins enabling it on button press to obtain temporary access to the lanc port. After power on by lanc. lanc or IR ? is used for futher control?. The lanc controller would have to control the presence of the 100k pins . During no button press , the 100k is removed. During lanc-button press , the 100k is swiched in, the lanc is pin active and the lanc command is sent, and when done the 100k switched out. Perhaps all in 1/6 of a second, causing a videooutput flicker. Or the IR command is sent instead causing no videooutput flicker.