In defense of Casual Divers

[TSandM]

I have to say, from experiences in the Caribbean, Australia and Hawaii, that a good DM is worth his or her weight in gold in enriching the dive experience for people who are not familiar with the area and its denizens. Life survives underwater often because it is so well camouflaged that nobody can find it to eat it; it takes time to learn to "see" the animals in their environment, and a good DM can find one thing after another that you would have missed entirely without the help.

I don't need a DM to navigate a simple reef, but I appreciate the help of one to make the dive experience richer and more fascinating. And I'm willing to accept some constraints on my freedom of operation in order to enjoy that guidance.

We are headed for Indonesia in September, and what I have read about the Lembeh Strait is that, if you don't stick close to the DM, you will miss the vast majority of the tiny, well camouflaged creatures that you went there to see.

I'd much rather have a regimented dive full of "oohs" and "aahs" than a dive on my own terms where I come back thinking there was nothing to see but black sand

 

[hudman10]

Divers who "just want to see pretty fish" still run the risk of blowing their lungs due to a rapid ascent from 20 feet.

I agree totally. My first open water dive with my entire family was in Cozumel with My father and brothers and wives. For all of the wives this was there first true open water dive. My wife couldn't relax enough after entry (and not weighted properly) to descend. Everyone else was at the bottom waiting for us at @ 40 feet. The DM came up and tried to calm her down after my attempts failed. He called of the dive. My step-mother held her breath a bit during ascent. That was the end of her vacation as a precaution (plus she was scared obviously). The point being (other than just because someone has a card doesn't mean the know what the hell they are doing and some people may be pressured into to doing something they may not really be comfortable doing (both my wife and step mother don't dive anymore)) we need as a everyone needs to know what the hell there doing in the water and be comfortable doing it. Otherwise, porblems arise.....................do you think that DM thought my step mother was the problem?? nope he was too busy trying to make sure the dive kept going so he was catering to his guest.

 

[lamont]

My less experienced take on the original post is that Howie feels the SB has been perhaps too focused on those people for whom diving is more that a hobby, it is a true calling, and not something that should be with hardcore effort for all ...or you're gonna die. I would suggest that divers who spend a certain amount of time (i.e. alot) on this board are more active in the sport than average once-a-year vacation diver and so the yearly divers don't have the social connection that others (hardcore for lack of a better term) within their own diving experience.
When an individual comes to SB with less experience board members generally want to help and give it very generously. But when it it isn't applied to a specific individual, rather to a population of a diver type, then they're all strokes waiting to happen and take you down to the briney deep. I'm over simplifying things here, but I have certainly noted a strong tendancy to flame or at least grill divers who are not the diver everyone else thinks they should be. It seems to tak on the appearence of "US v. THEM".
Can't we just enjoy what we do, however we do it. Can't we all just get along?

All I want are for recreational divers to be taught a rockbottom rule as simple as "300 psi plus 10 psi / ft". When they hit that limit I want them to be taught to thumb the dive. If their DM ignores them I want them to be taught to flip the DM off and ascend. On the first dive of every vacation they should practice at least one OOA and mask remove and replace. If they don't run out of gas and can react well to emergencies they're going to be much better off. I'd also like them to be taught option #1 and rules or suggestions for thumbing the dive before it even starts (stolen more from aviation than any diving TLAs). And I'd like them to be taught when they're going to be getting in over their head -- like divers with a dozen dives and an AOW card doing a cold water dive on a 100 fsw wreck in current.

They don't need to be taught how to do ratio deco.

 

[do it easy]

Can't we just enjoy what we do, however we do it. Can't we all just get along?

I guess I'm apathetic. I don't dive with these casual divers- they're Howie's problem and he's OK with it.

I don't see what all the fuss is about? Are these "casual" divers going to give the "hardcore" divers a bad name? Are they the reason that the coroner always rules the cause of death as drowning and the press reports that the tanks were filled with oxygen? Will these divers make my reg free flow or my drysuit leak?

 

[superstar]

I'm a vacation diver, I like to dive on cattle boats, I like shallow reefs with lots of pretty fish. I use an air-2. When I vacation on Roatan I want relaxing dives that are fun and guys like HowieDean make it possible.
Thank you HowieDean.

 

[ItsBruce]

All I want are for recreational divers to be taught a rockbottom rule as simple as "300 psi plus 10 psi / ft". When they hit that limit I want them to be taught to thumb the dive. If their DM ignores them I want them to be taught to flip the DM off and ascend. On the first dive of every vacation they should practice at least one OOA and mask remove and replace. If they don't run out of gas and can react well to emergencies they're going to be much better off. I'd also like them to be taught option #1 and rules or suggestions for thumbing the dive before it even starts (stolen more from aviation than any diving TLAs). And I'd like them to be taught when they're going to be getting in over their head -- like divers with a dozen dives and an AOW card doing a cold water dive on a 100 fsw wreck in current.

Well put.

 

[Zenshift]

The irony is in the people that post 5 paragraphs defending how intense they are about diving and why their "system" rocks are only identifying themselves as part of the group that he is talking about.

I have been in the military and law enforcement ... a basic rule of poker always comes up: if you play heavy, you have a weak hand. Translation: if you spend a lot of energy convincing people you are a "serious" ______ (ex: diver, MF'er, killer), you are not one, you are a poser.

I think he was defending his industry that takes in all divers to explore their underwater world. He watches for those that need a lot of help, gives credit to those that don't, and really watches for those that think that because they know what a wing and backplate are, they don't need help ... cause those are the ones that really can cause harm. Again, if you pose, you're not authentic.

An old zen saying: Those that don't know of "it", speak and those that do know of "it" do not say.

 

[grazie42]

An old zen saying: Those that don't know of "it", speak and those that do know of "it" do not say.

We must really be a board full of incompetents then...wait...I spoke about it...that must mean I don´t know what I´m talking about...

 

[Sharkbaithawaii]

All I want are for recreational divers to be taught a rockbottom rule as simple as "300 psi plus 10 psi / ft". When they hit that limit I want them to be taught to thumb the dive. If their DM ignores them I want them to be taught to flip the DM off and ascend. On the first dive of every vacation they should practice at least one OOA and mask remove and replace. If they don't run out of gas and can react well to emergencies they're going to be much better off. I'd also like them to be taught option #1 and rules or suggestions for thumbing the dive before it even starts (stolen more from aviation than any diving TLAs). And I'd like them to be taught when they're going to be getting in over their head -- like divers with a dozen dives and an AOW card doing a cold water dive on a 100 fsw wreck in current.

They don't need to be taught how to do ratio deco.

I think I kinda get what the original post was about. So stand by to flame away, putting the heat resistant body suit on.

In the big scheme of life, we all want everyone to know the most about everything they do and know they are properly trained when they do it, but lets live in the real world for once. For instance, I would love for everyone to know the two second rule when driving on the highway. But people don't know or they just don't use it and accidents still happen. That doesn't mean I want everyone to sit in a parking lot getting hours of experience before they get a driving licsense. It just means that I know it and I use it, and worry about myself when on the road and not what or how everyone else is driving. It all boils down to personal responsibility. I can show someone hundreds of gory accidents or tell the heart ripping stories about people loosing there life, but in the end we all make are own descisions. So instead of telling us about all the stories about OOAs and DCS and everythinig else, and trying to scare me into doing right, how about just teaching it the best way you can, and let me ask, if I have questions and go and dive away.
I think alot of people on here are to worried about a "right way" (no not a DIR dig), and not a way that is right for everyone. For the most part I think a majority on this board are recreational, but by that I mean they dive for fun, not just on holidays, and they have no more wants then some warm water and 100ft vis. Thats what recreational is right? Its about going out and having fun. If I am enjoying the way I do it then why is it your business that I use a modified suicide clip. If you are not gonna stop me when I am driving 30 miles over the speed limit, why are you gonna stop me to tell me my suicide Clip is dangerous to me.

Now don't get me wrong, I enjoy just reading and posting everyonce in a while, but for the most part I think this is all pretty funny, (Padi/Naui/SSI blah is better, DIR blah, BP/w Blah) I honestly think they every once in a while a troll goes and starts the same thread over just because its a slow week.

If your new and you really want to know, go find a dive site and talk to the divers. I say this because I have rarely met someone who is so anti/pro, Padi/Naui/SSI blah is better, DIR blah, BP/w Blah. Mostly its how was the vis, anything good out there, hows the temp and the current.

Get off the board and go dive.

And before you call me a noob, someone show me how to update this thing cause it aint worked and I don't feel like expending the energy.

 

[Sharkbaithawaii]

The irony is in the people that post 5 paragraphs defending how intense they are about diving and why their "system" rocks are only identifying themselves as part of the group that he is talking about.

I have been in the military and law enforcement ... a basic rule of poker always comes up: if you play heavy, you have a weak hand. Translation: if you spend a lot of energy convincing people you are a "serious" ______ (ex: diver, MF'er, killer), you are not one, you are a poser.

I think he was defending his industry that takes in all divers to explore their underwater world. He watches for those that need a lot of help, gives credit to those that don't, and really watches for those that think that because they know what a wing and backplate are, they don't need help ... cause those are the ones that really can cause harm. Again, if you pose, you're not authentic.

An old zen saying: Those that don't know of "it", speak and those that do know of "it" do not say.

AMEN