Instantly out of air!

[Max Speed]

I would go with an octo holder as well, so that there isn't a bolt snap hanging off the reg while in use.

I always have at least one reg with a bolt snap. Not a problem. So far....

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[Sevenrider860]

Now i can see why accidents and mishaps happen and panic may occur. Just a month ago a passed my OW.
We were taught by several PADI instructors on pre dive checks, yes test the octo where it is located and how it is released and when diving with a buddy go through the ooa situation.
What you quote is exactly what i would do in an ooa situation and that is exactly what PADI instructors are teaching. BUT you seem to dismiss this. ARE PADI DOING IT WRONG. You should know and your buddy where the octo is located and if ooa happened the actions both of you should expect. We performed this several times without any issues as per the pre dive check.
If you read the current padi manual it will advise you regarding octo location and ooa situations. Surely it should be a universal practise if being taught by padi ??? why would it change......
I am new to diving but if i was not happy with any aspects of my buddys equipment or procedures then i simply would not dive with them no matter how experienced they think they are.. reading the accident and mishap forum has really given me great insight and taught me valuable lessons in diving.
A lady on our trip had over 50 dives and was looking forward to her dive. but something happened and she paniced and grabbed the instructors reg. talking to her afterward she was so upset with herself for doing this as she had never done this before as stated that she knew she had done wrong. To her credit she did dive with us later that day and really enjoyed the dive.
My point being if you are diving with padi qualified divers then actions and procedures should be the same for both divers...

Keep doing it the way you were taught. As you get more dives and more experience you will see where these comments are coming from. As you get more experience, keep count of how many times you and your buddy are separated enough to make that calm OOA exercise you were taught a bit more of a challenge.

Take the PADI Rescue Diver course and learn that a panicked OOA diver is likely going to grab the regulator you are actually breathing from rather than grab the octopus you are exposing in that triangle between your ribs and chin. You have already witnessed that type of panic diver behavior. Regardless how embarrassed the diver was afterwards, which regulator did she grab from the instructor when she needed air? If that instructor did not want to "muck about with his own octo"...what was he going to breathe from after the lady snatched the working regulator out of his mouth?

As you get even more experience you may think about taking some PADI/DSAT Tec Courses. Guess what you learn? You will practice air drills that are different from your basic Open Water course. You keep a regulator on short hose under your chin and YOU offer the regulator you are breathing from to that OOA diver and you are prepared with your own regulator should the one you are breathing get snatched from your mouth by a panicked diver.

There is nothing wrong continuing to practice what you were taught. As you can tell from the original post, what you were taught works. With more dive experience you will see more things and situations where what you were taught is not what always happens and your thinking may evolve.

 

[Nwcid]

I am not disagreeing with you at all here but you fail to account for one MAJOR thing, human nature and the OP's situation.

How often do you dive with the SAME buddy every time? For me 90% of my dives are with the same buddy, my GF. The way the OP writes I get the impression that his dive buddy is his wife. Not that it is an excuse but when you dive with the same partner a lot you get complacent. I know my partners gear, she knows mine because we have the same gear. If I am diving with a new buddy I go though a much better buddy check.

I also agree with Sevenrider.

Now i can see why accidents and mishaps happen and panic may occur. Just a month ago a passed my OW.
We were taught by several PADI instructors on pre dive checks, yes test the octo where it is located and how it is released and when diving with a buddy go through the ooa situation.
What you quote is exactly what i would do in an ooa situation and that is exactly what PADI instructors are teaching. BUT you seem to dismiss this. ARE PADI DOING IT WRONG. You should know and your buddy where the octo is located and if ooa happened the actions both of you should expect. We performed this several times without any issues as per the pre dive check.
If you read the current padi manual it will advise you regarding octo location and ooa situations. Surely it should be a universal practise if being taught by padi ??? why would it change......
I am new to diving but if i was not happy with any aspects of my buddys equipment or procedures then i simply would not dive with them no matter how experienced they think they are.. reading the accident and mishap forum has really given me great insight and taught me valuable lessons in diving.
A lady on our trip had over 50 dives and was looking forward to her dive. but something happened and she paniced and grabbed the instructors reg. talking to her afterward she was so upset with herself for doing this as she had never done this before as stated that she knew she had done wrong. To her credit she did dive with us later that day and really enjoyed the dive.
My point being if you are diving with padi qualified divers then actions and procedures should be the same for both divers...

 

[SPARKMEL]

Hi Nwcid, no problems good discussion. i passed my OW with my 11 year old son who is a fantasic diver according to the instructors and he will be my buddy when we dive. Being taught together is a real bonus having the same instructors and skills. I have never dived with anyone else and would feel very nervous doing so after hearing some of the stories on here. I agree with you human nature how someone will react in that situation can be life or death. I can only dive to 12 m with my son which is fine for me so i can gain experience.
Cheers for the comments and happy diving.

---------- Post added August 9th, 2013 at 08:26 PM ----------

Hi Sevenrider, Thanks very much for your reply, it is good sound advise that i will take onboard. After a few more confidence boosting dives as you suggested my plan was to progress and take other courses. My 11 year old makes me even more cautious diving as i would never live with myself if anything happened to him. But the instructor made him fully understand that he is responsible for me. as i said to nwcid i am limited to 12 M buddying with my son which i am happy with.
Thanks for the advise....

 

[Adobo]

We were taught by several PADI instructors on pre dive checks, yes test the octo where it is located and how it is released and when diving with a buddy go through the ooa situation.

If you look at the OP's credentials, he seems to be pretty experienced. I was hoping to get some clarity as to what they did as far as predive checks. I know that in many of the boats I have been on while on vacation, very few of the seemingly experienced divers where doing comprehensive pre-dive checks.

What you quote is exactly what i would do in an ooa situation and that is exactly what PADI instructors are teaching. BUT you seem to dismiss this. ARE PADI DOING IT WRONG. You should know and your buddy where the octo is located and if ooa happened the actions both of you should expect. We performed this several times without any issues as per the pre dive check.

On dive boats, I have seen divers who use octos. Other divers use integrated air 2 type devices. And yet other divers use a back up regulator that is secured via bungy under their chin.

Some divers will donate an octo to an out of air buddy. Other divers will donate their primary reg to an out of air buddy. There are several different ways that mainstream scuba agencies are teaching as to how configure regulators.

A lady on our trip had over 50 dives and was looking forward to her dive. but something happened and she paniced and grabbed the instructors reg.

Here is the reality. When an out of gas diver is coming at you, he might signal that he is out of gas and reach for your octo. Or he might signal that he is out of gas and pull the reg out of your mouth. Or he might just pull the reg out of your mouth without telling you he is out of gas.

It might be worthwhile to consider that when fit hits the shan, the scenario might not unfold the way they did in a controlled environment like a class.

My point being if you are diving with padi qualified divers then actions and procedures should be the same for both divers...

Most people i dive with have qualifications from multiple agencies. And they are smart people - some have chosen to migrate away from the configuration they were taught in open water class. It's likely that at some point in your dive career, you will wind up in diving communities that have divers using various gear configurations.

The point of my original response to you is this - you mentioned that going to your octo would not be ideal if you found yourself somehow out of gas. And the reason you gave was that going to your octo required some mucking around. If indeed going to your octo is not as easy for you as it should be, then what I am pointing out is that there are many situations where you have to go to your octo in a hurry and so you better have it set up such that it is real easy to deploy and use.

 

[TSandM]

I'm pretty sure that if my regulator suddenly stopped delivering gas, I'd signal my buddy and share gas with him. THEN I might try my backup . . . but I wouldn't want to waste time on a first stage problem fiddling with my own backup reg, when my buddy is right there and has gas to share with me. Once I have something to breathe, I have a lot of time to sort the issue out. If I try my own backup and it doesn't work, either, then I've wasted that many more seconds of my breath-holding time and I'm no better off for having done so -- not to mention the fact that I probably stopped swimming while playing with this, so my buddy may be farther away than he was when the problem occurred.

It's like screwing up a gas switch . . . easiest solution is to go on buddy's gas and then sort the issue out.

 

[racerx_]

Totally agree with TSandM.. Going to your backup first seems like a good way to induce panic if that's not working either..

 

[DivemasterDennis]

Good report and good tip for proper maintenance of equipment at all times, not just during the dry periods between dives. Debbie and I include zip lock baggies to cover regs when we are out on shore dive excursions, and both rinse and purge regs before and after each dive. It doesn't take much material to interfere with a reg's operation. I have seen sand caked regulators on the shore of our local reservoir on some training weekends, and am surprised at the careless attitude some can have toward these important pieces of equipment.
DvemasterDennis