Lets Talk Wing Construction

[lowviz]

...//... That is quite the test. What made you decided to do that test?

It is complicated, but I'll try. I remember back when 'DIR' (now mostly GUE) asserted that there was no advantage to a donut wing over an 'isolated' (my term, somebody correct this) wing. They touted the ability to roll and inflate one side more than the other to correct for tank/gear/weight issues.

At that point, I noticed that different wings have their own 'feeling' to them. If I were a GUE sort, I'd want super-stable to keep me in trim. If I were a photographer, I'd want a wing that doesn't fight me if I choose some non-trim config in the water. Absolutely no help from the manufacturers.

Wing manufacturers: No 'wing-stability' rating? Seriously? Hell, anybody could figure that out. My (seemingly endless) project is still in progress, as I now realize that measurement for 'roll' is also critical. Sigh, back to the drawing board, steelyard, and welder. A pair of outriggers, spirit levels, and sliding weights should be the end of this.

If you doubt that roll matters for even a slightly mismatched set of double tanks, ring up @abnfrog about my last adventure up north with him...

...//...I have read a lot about the balanced rig. Part of the justification I am using of why we need to buy her a BP/W setup is because her current Ladyhawk won't fit over her new drysuit.

OK, so I assume that she is good with a back-inflate jacket. Good start. Forget about one wing for both singles and doubles.

You do the videoing, she dives and relates the single/double tank experience. Pick TWO wings.

Edit: Almost forgot. 'Shrink wrap' her suit with a water-vac on the purge valve, but leave the valve open, let her then inflate/purge until she is JUST comfortable, and then do some pool time. Maybe best just to leave the valve full open all the time. Use only the wing for buoyancy, forget the suit unless she is at depth, getting pinched, and has to compensate.

 

[tbone1004]

You posted exactly what I was curious about. I had wondered if this was all about marketing. I am understanding you correctly that Urethane based bladder may be slightly more durable than polyurethane?

it depends on what kind of durability you need. Arguably the laminated bladders like Halcyon will be more "durable" however since the bladder will not really be exposed to anything, it's practicality is debatable. Those fabrics though are not going to hold air as well as the other materials though and are more prone to pinhole leaks which are irritating to chase down, so longevity goes to the PU bladders.
The only thing that is probably a thing in terms of durability that does go to the laminated inner bladders is they are less prone to pinch flat, but that's operator error when you pinch the bladder between the tank and the deck. Pay attention and you'll be fine.
Again, this is not something that I personally would use as a buying decision.

 

[The Chairman]

One of the most durable wings out there:

How bad does your buoyancy need to be to need an incredibly durable wing?

I've seen the demos on all brands of wings with knives and crap and I don't see the need. I'm not going to dive through WWIII.

First, I have to admit to leaving the BP&Wing crowd for single tanks. I use the Zeagle Express Tech which is a hybrid with no hard plate. God, I love this BC.

I have to also admit, that I often dive it without a bladder attached. A dive op broke the shoulder flange (not the bladder) and I have yet to replace it. I found that I really only use my BCD as a life preserver on the surface, so I've got a sausage that can handle that.

With those caveats out of the way, like a snorkel, I find that with my BC, the cheapest is the best. I add so very little air to my BCD, if at all, that it just doesn't matter which I use. The gear doesn't make the diver.

 

[runsongas]

i would consider the zeagle ET, if you have the basic and not deluxe harness, a soft plate with 24lb horseshoe wing.

 

[tbone1004]

How bad does your buoyancy need to be to need an incredibly durable wing?

I've seen the demos on all brands of wings with knives and crap and I don't see the need. I'm not going to dive through WWIII.

First, I have to admit to leaving the BP&Wing crowd for single tanks. I use the Zeagle Express Tech which is a hybrid with no hard plate. God, I love this BC.

I have to also admit, that I often dive it without a bladder attached. A dive op broke the shoulder flange (not the bladder) and I have yet to replace it. I found that I really only use my BCD as a life preserver on the surface, so I've got a sausage that can handle that.

With those caveats out of the way, like a snorkel, I find that with my BC, the cheapest is the best. I add so very little air to my BCD, if at all, that it just doesn't matter which I use. The gear doesn't make the diver.

was actually an argument GI3 had with the Halcyon wings IIRC. They made them too durable which makes for lazy divers because they aren't terrified about their bc's failing.

 

[James79]

How bad does your buoyancy need to be to need an incredibly durable wing?

Just to play devils advocate... Sometimes the durability aspect is more about transport than in use. My prototype dirt cheap wing (thin, cheap reused nylon shell, swim ring bladder) died of a puncture in transport, but held up beautifully in actual use.
Respectfully
James

 

[Jack Hammer]

Most modern wings are pretty durable. However, some wings just "feel" better in the water than others. This can vary with the way you dive and your personal preferences. For me, the Halcyon wings feel "just right" as they're designed for the types of diving I do.

 

[The Chairman]

Sometimes the durability aspect is more about transport than in use.

Yeah, my wing died in Fiji by those who transported it from one boat to the next. The problem with making things foolproof is that fools are so ingenious in how they break things. They broke the plastic flange for the corrugated hose. I finished the week of diving 'old school' sans bladder.

 

[W W Meixner]

It is my nature to "think too much". Customer service is great but there are still differences in the dive rite wings that I think make my initial question valid. Dive Rite has the XT and EXP wings which have the same blader but a different shell. Is the XT super fabric worth the upgrade or will the ballistic nylon suffice? Are there instances where the abrasion-resistant fabric warrants the extra cost (eg: wreck or caves)?

D...

I've owned OMS...when OMS was family owned out of NY...I've also owned Dive Rite...and Scuba Pro X-Tek...

By far the OMS with urethane bladder was the best...quality of construction/material selection/quality of assembly/service use...I used them in the Atlantic/Pacific/Adriatic/Med...no defects/deficiencies/failures...ever!!!...I had a 60 pound lift Ocean with hazmat coating...and a 96 pound bungee'd Ocean double...

The same goes for the Dive Rite wings...of which I had three...excellent...two of the three had the armor fabric on the exposed side...

The Scuba Pro X-Tek is another story...seam failure during first dive/very poor quality/proprietary fittings/common generic replacement fittings will not work...the first wing was replaced with a second which was also defective...which was replaced for a third...

OMS for sure...but that's just me...

W...

 

[lowviz]

Most modern wings are pretty durable. However, some wings just "feel" better in the water than others. This can vary with the way you dive and your personal preferences. For me, the Halcyon wings feel "just right" as they're designed for the types of diving I do.

Oooooh!

You used 'personal preference' and Halcyon in the same post.

But then, you are a solo diver...