Planned air sharing/Hose of shame to extend bottom time

[BB`]

As a fairly new diver I am looking for some opinions about planning to share air to extend bottom time in non-emergency situations.

My experience:

Not long ago I went from someone who had never touched a regulator before through as much training as I felt I could absorb and then went on a dive trip to Cozumel. I met up with a buddy of mine and a nice couple who I would be diving with on the boat and the divemaster gave the option to signal when down to 1000psi (35cf)and he would offer his octo on a long hose to allow the dive to be extended for the group or we could abort the dive and surface as a group. With special note that it is not required and not to accept it if you didn't feel comfortable with it.


That of course being my 1st salt water dive ever with a brand new wetsuit and all rental gear I botched my weighting and even with an extra 3lbs the DM had brought specifically to donate I was still slightly buoyant and wound up doing an unpleasant amount of swimming to stay down. Mixed in with the pure amazement of seeing my 1st reef I burned air faster than I ever thought was possible and hit that mark after 25 minutes while my buddy still had 2300psi and I'm still not sure the DM was breathing with 2800psi left in his tank. We shared for a little under 30 minutes and I got the best guided tour of a reef I could ever imagine and was shown how to hide from the current before I went back to my tank we came up as a group for a safety stop and hit the surface with a 66 minute dive.


During the surface interval I was given some helpful pointers on just how different ocean diving with current was from the placid lake I learned in was. We jumped back in and did the 2nd dive of the day and once again I burned air faster than the group and hit the mark after 35 minutes and wound up sharing air to get out to a 69 minute dive.



To me it seems like a pretty safe way to stretch out bottom times and give the best experience to group as possible.


Thoughs?

 

[Nemrod]

Thing is that while this is a very bad practice, the DM is Cozumel have a SAC rate that is less than a decomposing body. They are accustomed to being at 2000 plus PSI when the rest of the group is at 750. Of course, then along came us and they started calling the dives on the excuse of having to go potty. But, to your question, in this case, while still not a best practice I will risk fire upon me and go ahead and say no big deal as long as the air sharing ended with both of you still above the decided upon 1000 psi reserve for beginning of ascent (or whatever value was appropriate).

N

 

[Instructor_Tom]

Although this is a practice that should not become a standard, as a working DM on weekends; being prepared to share air with a student diver is normal. I can usually end the day with about 1000psi while students go through 2 AL80s. If i actually don't have to work much during the day to help students it will be higher.

You need to get properly weighted and learn to relax during your dive.this along with proper fining will reduce your gas consumption. It comes with time in the water, there is no short cut.

Dive safe.

T.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD

 

[Tony387]

Seems very dangerous. When someone is sharing air, in my opinion, the dive is over. What if the DM has an equipment problem? Youve got two people with no redundancy. Unless two capable "buddies" are close by, or you're shallow enough for a safe ascent, you've got a big problem.

Sent from my SCH-I545 using Tapatalk

 

[BB`]

Seems very dangerous. When someone is sharing air, in my opinion, the dive is over. What if the DM has an equipment problem? Youve got two people with no redundancy. Unless two capable "buddies" are close by, or you're shallow enough for a safe ascent, you've got a big problem.

Sent from my SCH-I545 using Tapatalk

Can you expand on specifically why it is dangerous(looking for understanding of specific risks)?

My thinking in this case was if DM had a catastrophic problem where he instantly lost all gas we could switch back to my gear/tank (1000psi/35cu ft)and make an accent w/ safety stop and still be OK. Although my buddy probably would have been a better candidate based on his gas levels.

Although this is a practice that should not become a standard, as a working DM on weekends; being prepared to share air with a student diver is normal. I can usually end the day with about 1000psi while students go through 2 AL80s. If i actually don't have to work much during the day to help students it will be higher.

You need to get properly weighted and learn to relax during your dive.this along with proper fining will reduce your gas consumption. It comes with time in the water, there is no short cut.

Dive safe.

T.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD

Do you expect to share air because of low/out of air situations specifically?

After those 2 boat dives I wound up playing around just off the resort dock fine tuning my weights and getting the rig balanced to what I thought was comfortable. The last day of diving on that trip I had settled down to a .4 cu ft/m and managed to squeeze out a 90 minute dive (yes I am proud the improvement!)

 

[Mike]

As a fairly new diver I am looking for some opinions about planning to share air to extend bottom time in non-emergency situations.

My experience:

Not long ago I went from someone who had never touched a regulator before through as much training as I felt I could absorb and then went on a dive trip to Cozumel. I met up with a buddy of mine and a nice couple who I would be diving with on the boat and the divemaster gave the option to signal when down to 1000psi (35cf)and he would offer his octo on a long hose to allow the dive to be extended for the group or we could abort the dive and surface as a group. With special note that it is not required and not to accept it if you didn't feel comfortable with it.


That of course being my 1st salt water dive ever with a brand new wetsuit and all rental gear I botched my weighting and even with an extra 3lbs the DM had brought specifically to donate I was still slightly buoyant and wound up doing an unpleasant amount of swimming to stay down. Mixed in with the pure amazement of seeing my 1st reef I burned air faster than I ever thought was possible and hit that mark after 25 minutes while my buddy still had 2300psi and I'm still not sure the DM was breathing with 2800psi left in his tank. We shared for a little under 30 minutes and I got the best guided tour of a reef I could ever imagine and was shown how to hide from the current before I went back to my tank we came up as a group for a safety stop and hit the surface with a 66 minute dive.


During the surface interval I was given some helpful pointers on just how different ocean diving with current was from the placid lake I learned in was. We jumped back in and did the 2nd dive of the day and once again I burned air faster than the group and hit the mark after 35 minutes and wound up sharing air to get out to a 69 minute dive.



To me it seems like a pretty safe way to stretch out bottom times and give the best experience to group as possible.


Thoughs?

Aldora's been diving like that forever in Cozumel, the steel 120's didn't hurt too much either huh? There are pros and cons to many different ways to dive and the fact that Coz is live boating and drift diving changes some of the normal factors and adds a different method and protocols to diving compared to other places. Their absolutely pristine safety record speaks volumes beyond any criticisms anybody wants to bring up. Dave's operation and methodology is extremely conservative in everything they do, from limiting dive groups to even smaller than marine regulations call for, to the large tanks, to being one of the few dive ops who do their own fills and control the safety of them, the redundant safety gear, nautilus life lines, and not to mention the shear experience levels of their dive masters, some of which have over 10,000 dives under their belts and all of whom are instructors not just dive masters.

 

[kwinter]

My thinking in this case was if DM had a catastrophic problem where he instantly lost all gas we could switch back to my gear/tank (1000psi/35cu ft)and make an accent w/ safety stop and still be OK. Although my buddy probably would have been a better candidate based on his gas levels.

In your original post you said the DM would donate his octo on a long hose. Did you have a long hose on you octo? Now there's additional stress with a short supply, a hoover diver, and a short octo hose. Not the way I'd want to plan to end a dive.


Please pardon any typos. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Steve_C]

Under certain conditions I see no problem with it. In fact I think it is a great idea when mixing small groups of newbies and more experienced divers.

Was on a shallow drift dive off cancun. Instructor/guide and three of us. Had a diver burn through most of their air in 20 minutes. Instructor/guide gave him his spare, had him stop swimming and just suspended him below the DM. They drifted like that until time to go up and then he put the diver back on his own gas.

We were in 30 ft of water. Instructor/guide had dove with both of the other two divers so was familiar with our skill set. In fact both of us were DMC, one with him and one with another place. No one did not have sufficient air. It saved the dives for the other two of us. If the instructor would have had an air loss he could have shared with any of the three of us for an immediate ascent.

-------------

Added,

if the instructor had a catrostrophic loss it does not matter what he was doing he/she needs air. This situation is not so bad since there is a tank right there. Its going to be an air share to the surface no matter what. Just has to put the customer back on their tank before he takes the secondary.

--------------

I've had the reverse happen. Doing a night dive in Greece my guide ran somewhat low on air (had grabbed a not full tank) so borrowed some of mine for awhile. We were running shallow back to shore and it enabled us to keep looking for critters. Surface was just 10 ft above us. No problem. Key is to do the share while still air in the low tank.

 

[TSandM]

I have no problem with people sharing gas to extend bottom time, if a few conditions are met. It has to be done before anybody is low on gas, and not continued until anyone is limited on ascent gas. People have to be stable enough to be able to maintain gas sharing comfortably. (I do worry about the novice diver who sinks or rises and pulls the reg out of his mouth and panics.) And the gear configuration has to be such that two people can share gas while comfortably swimming side by side, which means a 5' or 7' hose.

My husband and I often do this when we are somewhere that constrains both of us to use Al80s. Five or ten minutes of sharing will equalize supplies and allow us to finish the dive happily together.

 

[swimmer_spe]

Plan the dive, and dive the plan.

You planned that at a certain PSI to share air. You then did that.

We all can give you a million reasons not to, but, you dove what you planned, and as long as it is not a common practice for you, then It is fine.

If something were to happen, yous till had 1000psi in your tank, right? So, you breath of yours, and he breaths off yours, and to the surface you go.