Scuba-hookah combo

[Guba]

After thinking about your dilemma for a bit, a couple of other ideas popped up. I'm still of the opinion that a hookah system that long would be more ungainly than one might first think, particularly in a horizontal line (Snuba and traditional hookah systems extend down, with the hose at least partially suspended by the surface buoy or boat). Dragging along a long hose horizontally poses a different set of problems. I first noticed that with considerably shorter tethers we use in low vis. The drag is noticeable. Try this...Using your current gear, you and your wife take a thirty foot section of garden hose on your next dive and carry it along as if it were the extended hose you're considering. Move apart, swim along, travel over the bottom as you would if it were your air hose, and also re-board the boat with it. (Suggestion...don't do this over delicate coral reef...I think you'd be surprised at the potential damage.) I could be wrong, but I suspect you might change your mind after experiencing the extra drag and inconvenience.

Not knowing what configuration your wife currently uses, these next suggestions might be irrelevant, but assuming she is using a more or less "traditional" gear config, they might have value. What I propose is along the lines of what the others suggest...streamlining much of the extra weight and "stuff" from her rig. There are a lot of back-inflation systems that considerably trim weight and clutter, and it will also "open up" the front of the system and seem much less confining. Using an inflator hose second means you can lose the octo, and there are lots of very small consoles on the market. If she uses a wrist computer, you could even drop down to a single gauge. Couple all of this with the lower volume, smaller tank, and the weight of the system will be considerably less and may even start rivaling the mass of the long hose you're considering.

By the way, one of my dive buddies uses a system very much like this, and it's remarkably comfortable and far less awkward than more traditional systems.

Just a suggestion.

 

[fjpatrum]

I think Guba's comments are spot on... if your wife is using a jacket BC she may really benefit from a back inflate style, or dare I saw a BP/W. I was really surprised how much less "encumbered" I felt while diving the BP/W I recently tried and it made a huge difference in my comfort, even with essentially the same weight and the same accessories. Combine that with a smaller steel tank and you may find you can remove all her ditchable weight and she will have significantly greater mobility.

I also like the idea of moving to a smaller console or wrist mount gauges, it will make a difference.

 

[danvolker]

Being a Scubaboard newbie, I hope I’m posting in the right forum? I’d like to get feedback about an idea I’m considering regarding how my wife and I scuba dive. We’re infrequent divers with moderate experience who dive only in open water conditions. Problem is my wife is a small person and the weight and hassle of the gear is causing discouragement. My idea is for me to dive in my normal configuration (backplate/wings) except with twin tanks and a manifold. To provide air for my wife, I would run a short air line from an unused low pressure port on my 1st stage to a waist belt connector at the small of my back. A 20-30’ low pressure line would then connect to my wife’s waist harness, then on to her regulator. In other words, she’s breathing from my air supply hookah-style. She would carry a small pony bottle and regulator for backup. I can’t see anything seriously wrong with this picture – can you?

Have you considered just using a "Brownies 3rd Lung" with her for a dozen or so dives until she wants more...wants to try scuba for the bigger range of dives possible with scuba. There may be a way to rent one through Brownies, or to buy a used one with a plan to sell it for close to the purchase price, 10 weeks later or so....Some people love using Brownies Third Lungs....for shallow dives( 40 feet or less) in warm water where your exposure suit does not have to change bouyancy a lot--as in lycra or thin wetsuits...the Brownies approach allows a cool feeling of freedom. For your wife, you would do most of the towing of the float, not that it is hard to tow, but with you purposely doing the work, she is in a zero workload system
You have 3 hours of air with the normal gas powered Brownies, and they now have a fancy new floating electric model that runs 60 to 90 minutes on a small battery, and the baterry can be swapped oout in about a minute if you want more diving. The electric is quieter, with none of the mess some people would think of with a gas engine.

Brownies has their own special bailout system, with a tiny tank and necklace reg, in case of a surface shut down event--like a huge ship running over your Brownie...
Regards,
Dan

 

[echodiver]

Guba and fjpatrum: She dives an OMS backplate/wing setup, an Atomic SS1 inflator/safe-second, a wrist computer and a separate pressure gauge. Great idea about testing drag with a garden hose. I’ll grab one of my air tool hoses that’s close to the diameter of a low pressure scuba line and try dragging that around in one of our local lakes. During a typical dive, we're often only 5-10 feet apart, but there are times we may separate to the hose limit, 20-30 feet. When close together, I’m pretty sure the air in the hose will keep the line above rather than below us We’ll see what the test hose does at various speeds! If I get a sense a reef structure is in any danger from this idea, the idea is dead.

Danvolker: We think alike! We tried a Brownie’s once years ago, before going the standard scuba route. We liked it. For reasons I can’t remember exactly – we decided on scuba instead. Since we paid for and own all the scuba gear, spending the dollars on a 3rd lung is probably not in the cards, though I haven’t ruled it out entirely. That new electric unit looks interesting – although 35 feet seems to be the depth limit from what I can tell, and the price seems to be near $4000 [gasp].

 

[danvolker]

Guba and fjpatrum: She dives an OMS backplate/wing setup, an Atomic SS1 inflator/safe-second, a wrist computer and a separate pressure gauge. Great idea about testing drag with a garden hose. I’ll grab one of my air tool hoses that’s close to the diameter of a low pressure scuba line and try dragging that around in one of our local lakes. During a typical dive, we're often only 5-10 feet apart, but there are times we may separate to the hose limit, 20-30 feet. When close together, I’m pretty sure the air in the hose will keep the line above rather than below us We’ll see what the test hose does at various speeds! If I get a sense a reef structure is in any danger from this idea, the idea is dead.

Danvolker: We think alike! We tried a Brownie’s once years ago, before going the standard scuba route. We liked it. For reasons I can’t remember exactly – we decided on scuba instead. Since we paid for and own all the scuba gear, spending the dollars on a 3rd lung is probably not in the cards, though I haven’t ruled it out entirely. That new electric unit looks interesting – although 35 feet seems to be the depth limit from what I can tell, and the price seems to be near $4000 [gasp].

I know the owner of Brownies, Robert Carmichael...he has told me this will go down well beyond 60 for 2 divers. Price is high....but the value of a diving lifestyle is high

There is always trying to rent or create some kind of purchase and then later sale...

Regards,
Dan

 

[GrumpyOldGuy]

I hesitate to suggest this, but you can buy a 25' hose from LP for $100 and make a Snuba type system. Just rig a harness for her so the 2nd won't get ripped out of her mouth. The hose length will limit her depth (good) as she will have no indication of tank pressure and if she has problems and you are not around, she has to CESA. Personally, I still think a small tank is the most practical and safest solution.

 

[fjpatrum]

Guba and fjpatrum: She dives an OMS backplate/wing setup, an Atomic SS1 inflator/safe-second, a wrist computer and a separate pressure gauge. Great idea about testing drag with a garden hose. I’ll grab one of my air tool hoses that’s close to the diameter of a low pressure scuba line and try dragging that around in one of our local lakes. During a typical dive, we're often only 5-10 feet apart, but there are times we may separate to the hose limit, 20-30 feet. When close together, I’m pretty sure the air in the hose will keep the line above rather than below us We’ll see what the test hose does at various speeds! If I get a sense a reef structure is in any danger from this idea, the idea is dead.

.

It occurred to me, if you're typically only 5-10 feet apart, how do you deal with the extra hose length? Is it coiled somewhere?

I don't think you'll find the air in the line floats the hose any more than short hoses float, which they don't, at least not on my gear- they drag below me when not secured properly. The hose weight, per foot, is the same no matter how long the hose and the air capacity within that hose will be constant per foot as well. No way it's going to float unless you modify it somehow. Even if it does somehow float, do you want 20 feet of "loose" hose floating along behind you as you swim, catching on whatever you happen to swim by?

 

[spoolin01]

I hesitate to suggest this, but you can buy a 25' hose from LP for $100 and make a Snuba type system. Just rig a harness for her so the 2nd won't get ripped out of her mouth. The hose length will limit her depth (good) as she will have no indication of tank pressure and if she has problems and you are not around, she has to CESA. Personally, I still think a small tank is the most practical and safest solution.

This seems like a good way to try out the hookah concept with the redundancy and independence of the 2nd tank, also w/o the expense of the 3rd lung. It might be that you both eventually decide on the snuba or 3rd lung approach. I guess the comfort issue will be the ergonomics of dragging around the hose and surface gear. On the other hand, with the two-headed diver approach you stay closer.

 

[echodiver]

danvolker: Nothing like friends in high places! Thanks for the info on the Brownie’s battery powered unit. We commonly dive between 40 and 80 feet, so maybe the Brownie’s could work. I’ll look into a home equity loan.

GrumpyOldGuy: The depth limit on a Snuba-style approach wouldn’t work so well for us. Since we usually dive between 40 and 80 feet, CESA wouldn’t work so well. Of course, she can carry a pony bottle, but neither of us being able to track her tank pressure is a concern.

fjpatrum: regarding dealing with the extra hose length: if we’re 10 feet apart with a 25 foot long hose, that means the hose loop extends above and behind us to a height of about 10.5 feet. At 5 feet apart, the hose loop extends 11.5 feet above us. How do I know this? I cut a loop of string 25 inches long, looped it on my desk and measured the height of the loop from the mid-point between the two ends (divers) up to the apex of the loop. If the line doesn’t float by itself, I guess I would have to add a small float to the mid-point. Ugh, more complication. BTW, Hookah divers routinely deal with much longer hose lengths – a 40 foot hose shared between two divers, combined with a single surface hose of 80 to 100 feet or more. You guys are making me work hard! Good thing.

Spoolin01 – there’s that “two-headed diver” thing again! I think Guba should trademark that term. Then the three of us could refine the design and market it as a Two Headed Underwater Breathing Apparatus – a THUBA!

 

[Guba]

Spoolin01 – there’s that “two-headed diver” thing again! I think Guba should trademark that term. Then the three of us could refine the design and market it as a Two Headed Underwater Breathing Apparatus – a THUBA!



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